06-16-2001, 06:33 PM | #41 |
Elminster
Join Date: April 28, 2001
Location: Virginia Beach, Virginia, USA
Posts: 490
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I have lived in many parts of Virginia, in Texas, and Georgia. I have visited such scenic places as South Korea and the middle east and I have seen places that do both better and worse than Americans. I have been to our big cities like New York, Chicago, and Atlanta, but when I went to Pusan I got a respiratory infection within hours of arrival because of the bad air quality. Thus, this is not a uniquely American problem. Everywhere I have lived there are local recycling programs that are government supported and widely used. We have carpool lanes on highways, we have more efficient appliances. can we do better? Yes. Are our lawmakers (slimy though they are, on both sides of the aisle) trashing the environment on purpose to make a buck. I don't think they are, and I am a pretty pessimistic guy. Eventually we will do better, but things won't happen overnight. The Kyoto treaty had some good concepts, however, the targets and goals were not based on science. That is why nobody ratified it. You see, people get nowhere when they exercise extremism. If you want real change, it must be done incrementally and in such a way that almost everyone (not just a simple majority, even) can support. Otherwise when power shifts slightly, all you fought for will be lost. That is why Bush and his staff are making incremental changes rather than sweeping ones.
PS: I don't mean to come off as Bush's personal bodyguard here, but he was the best option available out of a poor selection. I really wish people would get beyond the headlines and learn what the real agenda is. ------------------ Gaelic |
06-16-2001, 08:20 PM | #42 |
Welcomed New User
Join Date: May 24, 2001
Posts: 3
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The USA doesn't put out much co2 here's a picture:
You see from the picture that the US is mostly green/blue, which means that the US's emissions are low. Whereas red/black are the highest, which is in South America and Africa. The main site: http://visibleearth.nasa.gov/cgi-bin/viewrecord?8086 Here's something else to consider: Subaru makes a sports car called the Impreza WRX. This car features a 2.2L turbocharged 4-cylinder engine that puts out about 280 horsepower, and baby that’s a shitload of horsepower from a 4-cylinder engine. Now this car’s engine has this horsepower rating in every county in the world (Japan, Australia, Europe) except the US, where it mysteriously loses 50 horsepower, dropping to 227 horsepower. Why? Emissions control. In fact this car wasn’t even available in the US until last year. If you’re thinking that the US doesn’t want the population having a powerful car/engine, here’s a list of cars that are/were available: Toyota Supra Twin Turbo 6-cyclinder: 320 horsepower (no longer made) Mazda RX-7 Twin Turbo rotary: 300? Horsepower (no longer made) Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo 6-cyclnder: 300 horsepower (no longer made) Mistsubishi GT 3000 VR4/Dodge Stealth Twin Turbo 6-cyclinder: 320 horsepower (no longer imported) Chevrolet Camaro Z28 or Z28 SS 8-cyclinder: 305/320 horsepower Ford Mustang Cobra 8-cyclinder: 320 horsepower Chevrolet Corvette (C5) 8-cyclinder: 345 horsepower Chevrolet Corvette Z06 8-cyclinder: 385 horsepower Pontiac Firebird Trans AM/WS6 8-cyclinder: 305/320 horsepower Dodge Viper 10-cylinder: 450 horsepower [This message has been edited by igor782 (edited 06-16-2001).] |
06-16-2001, 09:05 PM | #43 | |
The Magister
Join Date: June 7, 2001
Location: Manchester
Posts: 147
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Quote:
Igor782 (btw, can I call you Igor for short, just as Billikins is a perfectly good name for me), very interesting CO maps. I shall have a good stooge around on these come monday. At a guess, and this is only a guess they look like the effect of fires. As I said I'll do some digging on this (current work project permitting, work-wise things are hectic at the moment). As to what can be done: well, the old motto of "Think global, act local" applies. Personally, I cycle the 7 miles to work. Not only do I save roughly £3000 a year, I also don't need to go to the gym and I'm the most wide awake person in my office come 8:30! One last thing for Gaelic, and I'm flagging cos its sunday morning now, and I've had a nice night out but, you enjoy scuba diving hey? Cool, same here. Recently spent a week diving in the Red Sea: man, there's some nice dives there. I have a feeling that I may be just a leeetle jealous as I guess you can go wet suit diving near where you live! Not quite the same in the UK, but never mind. Hopefully off to Thailand (again) for a month over Christmas to do the Similians. {edited cos I forgot what day of the week it was... duh} ------------------ Fear? I know not the meaning of the word. And you can keep that dictionary away from me! [This message has been edited by Billikins the Bold (edited 06-16-2001).] |
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06-16-2001, 09:06 PM | #44 |
Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom
Join Date: March 12, 2001
Location: Birmingham, West Mid\'s, England
Age: 87
Posts: 2,859
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Um. Igor? You are talking about carbon DIoxide, but showing pictures of carbon MONoxide. Two different things. I think it is carbon dioxide that is the principle greenhouse gas though not positive on this. And anyway, the high levels in the south were caused by forest fires which are shortterm, even if they do pump out a lot at the time. What industrial countries pump out is long term, and persistant. This is not to say that the forest fires are not seriously damaging to the environment, 'cos they ARE, but the planet is accustomed to dealing with it. What it is NOT accustomed to is the steadily increasing pollution caused by the increasing combustion of fossil fuels.Oh, and WELCOMEto the board!------------------ [This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 06-16-2001).] |
06-16-2001, 09:43 PM | #45 |
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Posts: n/a
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FYI:
carbon dioxide:a heavy colorless gas CO2 that does not support combustion, especially in animal respiration and in the decay or combustion of animal and vegetable matter, is absorbed from the air by plants in photosynthesis, and is used in the carbonation of beverages. carbon monoxide:a colorless odorless very toxic gas CO that burns to carbon dioxide with a blue flame and is formed as a product of the incomplete combustion of carbon. It is carbon monoxide poisoning the atmosphere. Plants absorb carbon dioxide and in return supply us with oxygen. Humans (non smoker anyway lol) exhale carbon dioxide. One reason I can't stand to see plants die or forests ravaged unnecessarily. Live globally, act locally is a good motto to live by. Unfortunately we are a penniless minority against the machines of capitalism. Do your part anyway and there remains hope that a difference can be made. Moni ------------------ [This message has been edited by Moni (edited 06-16-2001).] |
06-16-2001, 09:56 PM | #46 |
The Magister
Join Date: June 7, 2001
Location: Manchester
Posts: 147
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Ah. Actually, carbon dioxide *is* the major greenhouse gas.
------------------ Fear? I know not the meaning of the word. And you can keep that dictionary away from me! |
06-16-2001, 10:56 PM | #47 | |
Silver Dragon
Join Date: March 4, 2001
Location: Knoxville, TN USA
Age: 60
Posts: 1,641
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Quote:
your on leaders for doing the same. Seems to me that they are only giving lip service to the cause! At least Bush is honest about it. Sorry if I step on any toes here, but what's good for the goose is good for the gander. And vis-versa. ------------------ Sir Taliesin If they take my gun can I still use my Axe? |
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06-17-2001, 12:21 AM | #48 | |
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So again I declare our hands tied on a world-wide level until the people in control take action to put an end to the abuse of power. I'll say again that we can only do what we can on a local level and hope that enough people with authority who care enough about future generations existence on this planet get together and do something. Think it will happen? I'm not going to hold my breath. Anyway...here is a very informative link that everyone debating this issue should take a look at: World Energy Projections It can answer some open questions, stomp out some doubts, open the tables to new discussions and give all of us a better overall view of what is happening on a world-wide level. Moni ------------------ |
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06-17-2001, 05:10 AM | #49 | |
The Magister
Join Date: June 7, 2001
Location: Manchester
Posts: 147
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Quote:
But yes, thats the way to go and it seems that it will happen. As yet, our leaders have not said they won't ratify. If they do renege on their promises you will most definetly hear one hell of a noise! ------------------ Fear? I know not the meaning of the word. And you can keep that dictionary away from me! |
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06-17-2001, 05:26 AM | #50 | |
Thoth - Egyptian God of Wisdom
Join Date: March 12, 2001
Location: Birmingham, West Mid\'s, England
Age: 87
Posts: 2,859
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Quote:
Only one thing I don't agree with fully in your comments - that our hands are tied. I do not believe that. When enough people get mad enough the goverments will find THIER hands tied by US, the voters. The trick is to get the voters motivated! After all, who is prepared to lower their standard of living just to save the planet? Who is prepared to make sacrifices just for the sake of their children and grandchildren? "WE are ok. WE are making a fast buck. Let the future take care of itself." seems to be the prevailing attitude. But we ARE changing, albeit slowly, and maybe TOO slowly. ------------------ [This message has been edited by Fljotsdale (edited 06-17-2001).] |
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