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Old 11-22-2003, 02:08 AM   #61
Night Stalker
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Quote:
Originally posted by Animal:
If it sounds like a duck, walks like a duck and looks like a duck, it's probably a duck.
But until he has his day in court, he's an innocent duck. A weird duck - yes, but an innocent one.

I'll reserve judgement until the jury does. I abhore Trial by Media and Exploitumentaries.

[ 11-22-2003, 02:10 AM: Message edited by: Night Stalker ]
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Old 11-22-2003, 02:46 AM   #62
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Just to note. In the last couple of days I have seen brief interviews with Nicole (?) Ritchie, Lionel's daughter. She says she spent many nights at Neverland and that there would often be a group of kids, Michael (and perhaps other adults?) who ended up "crashing" in the same room, but that she never saw or experienced anything at all untoward. She's 22 now, and says she just can't believe the allegations. She asserts that if anything of the sort ever did occur, she was the kind of vocal kid who would have told someone about it, at the very least her parents. Her statemenets tend to line up with Macauley Culkin's.

MJ's neighbor, a kid in his early teens, has also visited twice, and says nothing of the sort ever occurred.
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Old 11-22-2003, 03:14 AM   #63
Horatio
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Quote:
Originally posted by johnny:
Timber's words got me thinking. What if he really thinks he's still a child himself ? Kids crawl up to eachother in bed all the time. I know it's twisted, but if Michael is still a child, in his own mind, and he's really convinced of it, than he didn't do anything wrong. What "normal" people see as unacceptable, might be totally innocent in his mind.

If all he did was allow that kid to sleep in his bed, then there's nothing wrong. Not if Michael truly thinks he's still a kid himself. The human brain works in mysterious ways.
Still, he's obviously pretty ill. If a forty year old man down your road molested your kid, then shrugged and said "Hey, I'm a child myself!" You wouldn't think twice before phoning the police and pushing the case all the way. Michael needs severe mental aid, and prison could actually be the best thing for him.
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Old 11-22-2003, 03:29 AM   #64
johnny
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Maybe, but a psychiatrist would be of more use, IF he truly believes he's still a kid. Don't get me wrong, if it's sexual stuff that's on his mind when he's around kids, then he should be locked up. But when he's a child himself, in his own mind, then there's a real challenge for any shrink.
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Old 11-22-2003, 03:53 AM   #65
Cerek the Barbaric
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Quote:
Originally posted by johnny:
Timber's words got me thinking. What if he really thinks he's still a child himself ? Kids crawl up to eachother in bed all the time. I know it's twisted, but if Michael is still a child, in his own mind, and he's really convinced of it, than he didn't do anything wrong. What "normal" people see as unacceptable, might be totally innocent in his mind.

If all he did was allow that kid to sleep in his bed, then there's nothing wrong. Not if Michael truly thinks he's still a kid himself. The human brain works in mysterious ways.
I think you are very close to the truth here, Johnny. I remember reading somewhere that MJ does consider himself to still be a child (in a Peter Pan sort of way). In his mind, there is nothing wrong with him sharing a bed with one or more young children (who aren't his own or part of his family). He feels it is just like a "sleepover" that any normal 10-12 yr old kid would have. The only problem with this (of course) is the fact that MJ is NOT 12yrs old!!!! Just because he sees nothing wrong with what he is doing does not mean it is innocent or acceptable. A sociopath has no moral conscious. In their eyes, there is absolutely nothing wrong with killing somebody (for whatever reason). But just because they don't feel it's a crime doesn't mean our court systems will agree.

As for Jackson being "convicted in the media", this is due in large part to many of his own comments. He has said that he adores children and considers them beautiful little people. He has also said he enjoys being able to "share his love" with these children during the sleepovers when they share his bed. Now, as a 40yr old man myself, I am VERY nervous about anybody MY age saying they want to "share their love" with a 12yr old child in their bedroom. That sends up a whole fleet of red flags in my eyes.

Consider this example....When I was younger, one of my favorite things to do when I went to a big shopping mall was to go into the arcade and play some of the games. I especially enjoyed playing the games that would give out tickets that could be redeemed for prizes. I didn't want any of the prizes for myself. What I would do is win a handful of tickets, then look for some small kid that only had a few tickets. Knowing the prizes would mean much more to him/her than they ever could to me, I would walk over and give my tickets to him/her. I did it just for the joy of seeing their faces light up. It was a perfectly innocent gesture, and was also acceptable when I was in my late 20's (and maybe even early 30's). However, if I were to do it NOW (at the age of 40), it would look very suspicious. {Why is that 40yr old man giving free tickets to that small child? Quick, somebody call security and have this guy followed} Do you see what I'm saying? There comes a point in time when you have to realize that - even if YOU consider your actions to be innocent - you have to consider how they appear to other people. Michael Jackson - of ALL people - should have learned this lesson 10yrs ago.

Here is another rebuttal for those who feel Jackson is just being "tried in the media"...this is a link to the actual court document and official statement made by his accuser 10yrs ago and recorded by the court officials. I myself was never positive of his guilt or innocence until I read this document. Read the court papers for yourself, including the very specific and graphic details of sexual encounters between MJ and the boy, and then decide if you still think Michael Jacksons interactions with young children are innocent and acceptable.

Court Documents of Michael Jackson's original accuser
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Old 11-22-2003, 06:51 AM   #66
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I'm glad that this thread doesn't turn in a new 'Michael Jackson bashing thread' like we had last time. I really, really like his music, and maybe that's also the reason why I can't or won't believe all the allegations that have been made against him.

The man has been successful for over 30 years, he was pushed in show business when he was very young. He never had a normal youth. And that's why I think he's still looking to be a child again: because he has never had the opportunity to be one in the first place.

I could be looking at one side of the coin here, but this is just my two cents. Michael Jackson may be crazy, but so is the world.
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Old 11-22-2003, 07:08 AM   #67
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Quote:
Originally posted by johnny:
Timber's words got me thinking. What if he really thinks he's still a child himself ? Kids crawl up to eachother in bed all the time. I know it's twisted, but if Michael is still a child, in his own mind, and he's really convinced of it, than he didn't do anything wrong. What "normal" people see as unacceptable, might be totally innocent in his mind.

If all he did was allow that kid to sleep in his bed, then there's nothing wrong. Not if Michael truly thinks he's still a kid himself. The human brain works in mysterious ways.
And if he thinks he is a kid?
that still doesn't make it ok, still i don't think it is molesting but bordering there. Although mentally he may think he is a child, physically he isn't and he is 45 so that gives him some responsibility not to sleep with children.
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Old 11-22-2003, 04:47 PM   #68
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But is there any proof that he actually molested them, or did they just sleep ?
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Old 11-23-2003, 03:34 AM   #69
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Apparently it was his shrink that notified the police about a possible case of child molestation. The shrink was required by law to notify the authorities if there was even a chance. Anyway that seems like what it was that got the ball rolling on the investigation.
But who knows... I figure either he did it or the police have taken it way too far. I think it is likely that the overzeleous police looked into it and then a parent got scared and ended up believing their child had been molested and then went and talked the child into testifying.
I saw on television some guy talking about how there is now another victim like it is plain as day that there was indeed a victim 10 years ago. If I were MJ I would be filing a lawsuit right now if someone went on national television and said that. Of course if he is guilty it would make sense he wouldn't try to sue since then the facts might actually get brought to light.
I too would like to know what kind of evidence they have. They have a lot circumstantial evidence but do they have any physical evidence because without any physical evidence it's going to come down to his word against the childs. I read the smoking gun link but that doesn't make sense since I heard the child didn't want to testify against MJ and the boys parents could have put him up to writing that. Has anyone heard what they found at his place(aside from drugs)?
Of course what I'd really like is for it to be all over and done with so I could turn on the TV without seeing MJs face on every other channel.
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Old 11-24-2003, 05:40 PM   #70
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How do you know what time is bedtime at Michael Jacksons house?...........
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When the big hand reaches the little hand...... [img]tongue.gif[/img]
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