The murder of a murderer....

Originally posted by Alexander: That's nice, but you're not likely to be beaten or raped on an aircraft carrier. Why don't you actually go spend a few days in a prison and then you can tell us about the blissful paradise it is.

Umm I wouldnt bet on that...there are several people who manage to ....not get home each year on carriers. Doesnt make the news a lot, but sailors do get raped (men and women) they get beaten robbed and abused....all the things that happen in a small town happen in the small town called an aircraft carrier.

I don't need to spend a few days in prison, the one I toured was quite enough, and the two days in the brig I spen while in the Navy was enough...but on the whole it could have been worse...

[ 05-30-2002, 02:38 PM: Message edited by: MagiK ]

[Arnabas]

Nobody ever said it was a "blissful paradise".
But why do we have to GIVE criminals MORE than many non-criminals are able to EARN?
Yes, they are still human and have rights. Sure, no problem. Let's not punish them TOO much for their crimes.

[Talthyr Malkaviel]

Originally posted by Arnabas: I might have to leave this thread for a while... It is so frustrating to me that people care more about the rights of criminals than the people they rape, torture and murder. "Mr. Smith, you have killed 20 people. This court sentences you to a long hug to raise your self esteem, because it is our own fault that you became homicidal. The victims and their families should be ashamed of what they did to you..." Yes, in a perfect society, we could rehabilitate everyone and there would be no need for capital punishment. But are we living in a perfect society?

No we aren't, but that's like saying "because we haven't solved the problem yet we may as well not try to anyway, I mean what's the point, it doesn't work now, that's what's important, right?"

Originally posted by Arnabas: I am soooo tempted to be snotty to you, Dramnek, but I am trying to accept that we simply have different views.

And I’m tempted to rant and rage at you, since you are suggesting policies, which the Nazi’s enacted, to the great detriment of mankind.

Originally posted by Arnabas: I just don't see why you (seem to) think that criminals deserve better treatment than other members of society.

I never said criminals deserved better treatment that the rest of society, just EQUAL treatment, as is their fundmental right as Humans.
Unless of course you want to argue that Criminals are "Weniger als Mensch".

Originally posted by Arnabas: [QB]Nobody ever said it was a "blissful paradise". But why do we have to GIVE criminals MORE than many non-criminals are able to EARN?

Uhhh, we don’t actually give prisoners any money at all.

[Arnabas]

Dramnek, I want to take the high road with you, but you insist on being an @$$...
How on Earth do you compare wanting to protect innocents from murderers and rapists to the policies of the Nazis?
Am I a Nazi because I think criminals should be held accountable for their crimes? Am I a Nazi because I think murder and rape are bad things? Does stopping a killer from ever killing again really equal murdering millions of Jews for no reason whatsoever?
And I wasn't referring to money. Plenty of people can't afford air-conditioning, TV, etc, but guess who gets them free? Actually, not quite free... They EARN it by raping and murdering. Ok.

[ 05-30-2002, 02:47 PM: Message edited by: Arnabas ]

Originally posted by Dramnek_Ulk: quote:

I never said criminals deserved better treatment that the rest of society, just EQUAL treatment, as is their fundmental right as Humans.
Unless of course you want to argue that Criminals are "Weniger als Mensch".[/QB][/QUOTE]Why should we treat criminals as equals to law abiding, productive members of society? Usually I can see a little of where you are coming from but this is beyond my grasp.

[Attalus]

Guys, guys, remember what Memnoch said. Resorting to personal attacks gets us no forrader. Ask yourselves, Why am I posting this? To explain my position or to denigrate the other? "A man convinced against his will/ Is of the sme opinion, still."

Originally posted by Arnabas: Dramnek, I want to take the high road with you, but you insist on being an @$$... How on Earth do you compare wanting to protect innocents from murderers and rapists to the policies of the Nazis? Am I a Nazi because I think criminals should be held accountable for their crimes? Am I a Nazi because I think murder and rape are bad things? Does stopping a killer from ever killing again really equal murdering millions of Jews fo no reason whatsoever?

I’m not saying you are a nazi,
But the policies you were suggesting were pretty much what the Nazis did, for example experimenting on criminals for drug testing
and well call me silly if you like, but I just seem to have this little dislike for people being made to suffer in any way or be needlessly killed, even criminals.

Originally posted by MagiK: Why should we treat criminals as equals to law abiding, productive members of society? Usually I can see a little of where you are coming from but this is beyond my grasp.[/QB]

Do you want to uphold the universal declaration of human rights?
If so, you must apply it without exception, otherwise it is useless.
I still think that murderer’s should serve life in prison, but that does not mean they should surrender their human rights does it? For if we do not apply them to all, how can we expect (or even deserve) others to apply them to us?