Stamina Issues

[sponkly]

Does anyone out there know anything specific (or any good links) explaining how the stamina "usage" is decided in Wiz8? For example, I find it kinda bogus that my snipers (Ranger and Gadgeteer), run out of stamina much faster (proportionally) than my melee specialists. From a role-playing perspective, I think it would be more normal for swinging a heavy weapon like a sword or a mace while wearing heavy armor to use more stamina per attack than shooting a bow and arrow or a rifle. This would, to my mind, justify having the stamina attribute tied to Str and Vit, which are clearly important melee attributes, while Dex, which gives no help to stamina, is most important for ranged combat. Instead, my fighter-types (Lord, Valk, Samurai & Monk) never have any stamina problems, while I am constantly having to "boost" my sniper's (and my Bard, but that is ok .. read on) stamina during combat.

To be more specific, my Lord is dual-wielding Bloodlust and a stiletto and routinely gets 7 or more attacks per round while hasted, and he "uses" virtually no stamina. My ranger and gadgeteer get 5-7 shots off per round and they are passing out after 5 rounds or so. Also, the stamina usage does not seem to be tied to the weapon skill level, which is strange. For example, just to check how all of this works, I tried giving Bloodlust to my Ranger for a while and sticking him in the front lines ("You'll be fine ... just stick them with the pointy end") ... he has low skill levels in Sword and Close Combat (like 8 or so), compared to my Lord (who has around 60 in both). To my surprise (and dismay), he also used almost no stamina, even though he was now swinging a heavy, unfamiliar weapon under strange new circumstances. For reference, the stamina-sucking Ranger's skill levels in Bow and Ranged Combat are both in the 80's.

So .. now that I have revealed myself as a true RPG-geek who spends way too much time and effort thinking about this stuff .. does anyone have any answers or comments? Have I missed something important in my analysis? Enquiring minds (well, mine at least) want to know ...

[Scatter]

There are a few things in W-8 that don't make "sense" (imagine swinging a wooden staff around underwater...) and the Stamina thing is one of them.
I can see maybe the pull of the bow taking some effort, but i really think it's off, and especially the firearms, they shouldn't hardly use any work to operate.
Melee weapons have a connection between their weight and Stamina use.

[Nightowl2]

Never mind the staff, consider missile weapons You can chuck stones or arrows just as well as on land. You can do everything just as on land except for casting fire spells. And as far as that goes, you ought to be able to at least do a Psionic Fire, as that's mental (or supposedly so), and fries the brain as opposed to doing injury to the body.

And yeah, the stamina stuff is very oddly implemented in the game. I agree that it should take less to operate ranged weapons as opposed to melee. But I guess they wanted to make sure you'd use those stamina replenishment spells

Nightowl2

[babar]

maybe some physics scholars can comment on the amount of force required to move a 5 lb sword back and forth in the process of attacking and parrying and the force required to propel X number of missles of weight say .2 lb enough fly Y feet in distance. Personally I failed every physics class I've ever taken, so I don't know.

Aside from that, from the physiologically stand point, the repetitive motion of shooting an arrow while stationary has got to give you a higher lactic acid build up (contributing to fatigue) in the upper body as opposed to dancing about fighting, where hopefully, your cardiovascular system can do whatever it does to eliminate it.

But of course, it's a different planet, one where talking lizards shoot psionic fires out their heads, 700 year old guys run used good shops in the middle of a swamp and all the women who don't look like spiders or hampster have huge WANKAWANKAWANKAs. So maybe thinks work a little differently over there.

[Rawhide]

If anyone's studied English history, they'll remember that we were once fond of longbows. The archers in question were often yeomen or farmers who practised for at least an hour every week (I think on Sundays), because it was a legal obligation. Old skeletons show huge deformities of the shoulders and spine because they developed to take the massive strain of bending a bow. A yew bow which is 6 feet tall can easily take a force of over 300 pounds to bend to fire an arrow. This, done very quickly (more than 6 times a round in Wiz8), is extremely tiring. I have tried. Imagine lifting a 300 lb weight every few seconds and holding it (while you aim, which they never did in big battles, but you do in Wiz 8), and you can see that it's quite possibly as tiring as wearing heavy armour and swinging a sword around.
If anyone's ever tried wielding a sword as well, you'll find it tiring, but only in the arm/wrist because people tend not to be strong enough to wave a sword accurately for very long. It's full body excersise, and if you're in armour you're not jumping around; you're just going to get very hot. Additionally, in Wiz8 the fighters tend to have high strength, which indicates fitness and stamina, whereas you'll focus on dex for rangers.
What I find ridiculous is how much people can carry. If you carry 60lbs you'll find it hard to jump around; fighters/valkyries etc. who can carry 180lbs (at the end) without even being slightly encumbered are ridiculous, even if they are another species, and heroes of that species. I suppose it makes up for the large weights of various items and the fact that you can't drop important items even after they've been useful.

[Nightowl2]

Of course, we're all just blathering here. Wiz 8 is fantasy. If we wanted reality, we wouldn't be playing these games

Nightowl2