Bards and Powercast

[LewyRay]

Spitball brought this up in another post, but I thought this deserved some attention on it's own.

The question I have is wheather powercast can help a bard get stronger, more lasting affects from their instruments? I had not considered this for my Bard before Spitball mentioned this.

And as an extension, is the same true for Gadgeteers? How about a fighter or rogue reading scrolls? Has anyone experimented with this at all?

[Krull]

Powercast does nothing for either the Bard or Gadgeteer (similar question was asked on the VN Board a couple of months back) so don't waste putting points into it.

Powercast only helps the spellcasters.

[SpitBall]

If PowerCast does nothing for the Bard or Gadgeteer - why did my Bard acquire this skill?

[Krull]

Once you reached 100 in INT it automatically opens up the Powercast skill.

I've just looked at the manual and I can't see where it even mentions the expert skills let alone tell you that Powercast is just for actual spellcasters.

When I first started playing Wiz8 three years ago I made the same error by putting points into Powercast for a Bard, imagining that it would let me use instruments consistently at level 7 all the time and doing away with fizzles. Oh well.

[DinkumThinkum]

Originally posted by Krull: I've just looked at the manual and I can't see where it even mentions the expert skills let alone tell you that Powercast is just for actual spellcasters.

The Expert Skills are listed in Appendix 4, at the very end of the other skill descriptions:

"POWER CAST: The ability to cast a spell with such force that it increases
the original effectiveness and duration of the spell and makes it more
difficult to resist."

That doesn't specifically say the skill doesn't apply to Bard and Gadgeteer spell effects, but all the Wiz 8 web sites I've browsed talk about it as being strictly for spell casters.

And, as you said, characters automatically get expert skills once the associated attribute maxes out. If you raise a rogue's or fighter's Intelligence to 100, they'll get Power Cast even though they have absolutely no use for it unless they change to a spell-casting class at some point.

[Krull]

Thanks DT.

I missed that (obviously!).

[SpitBall]

You are likely correct - I have no evidence that Power Cast has helped the Bard. But, the game treats Bard instruments as Magick in that they can be silenced and they are reflected by Eye4Eye spells, so I had assumed these would also be treated as Magick with regard to Power Cast. I don't know about Gadgeteers because I have little experience with them. But, apparently this is another example of logical dissonance within Wiz 8.

Perhaps the better question is: which bonus skill DOES help a Bard? Dex? Sens?

[DinkumThinkum]

Increasing the two attributes the Bard's Music skill depends on would probably help, but I don't think any of the expert skills has a specific benefit for a Bard.

As far as I know, Power Cast only applies when characters actually cast spells themselves; it doesn't affect casting spells with scrolls, bombs, instruments, gadgets, etc., so it's useless for non-casters.

Most of the other expert skills have at least a limited application for any character.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dexterity of 100 gives Reflextion, which helps armor class.

Senses of 100 gives Eagle Eye, which helps with ranged weapons.

But I can't think of any that would specifically help a Bard as a musician, rather than just helping their offense or defense.

[Krull]

I think (IMHO) DEX is the most important attribute for a Bard. DEX is the primary attribute for Locks & Traps, Music and Pickpocket. DEX is also one of the controlling attributes for all the weapon skills. So Reflexion is the most important expert skill for a Bard I would say.

As for the other, I'm not too sure. INT is the other controlling attribute for Locks & Traps and Music. But Bards need VIT so they don't pass out playing their instruments and Iron Skin reduces damage, of course.

I usually go for SPD, and therefore Snake Speed, so they can use their instruments first in combat (to cast Haste, Freeze All, Heal All etc). And, of course, it adds more attacks/swings per round.

(Edit: Forgot to mention that DEX also helps the number of attacks and the chances of hitting in combat of course)

[ 04-14-2005, 03:42 PM: Message edited by: Krull ]

[SpitBall]

Exactly, Krull, I've been adding to INT and DEX for the Bard - INT has already maxed and DEX will max very soon. Again, it seems logical that maxing the skills that "help" the Bard would unlock Expert Skills that benefit that class.