Survivor's "Grinding" -- possible spoiler for non-US viewers

[Ronn_Bman]

If you're not in the US, and your Survivor schedule is a week or two behind the US Survivor episodes, this may be a spoiler for you...

***Beware***
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I know this is about a TV show and, for that reason, may belong in another forum here, but I'm more curious about the social implications of the "grinding" episode, so I've posted here(that and the fact that waaaaaaaaaaaaay more people check here ).

One of the ladies claims a male on the team was "grinding" his privates against her in the night! She claims it was ok for him to hold her(he asked first-while they were going to sleep), but that he took it too far during the night. She also complains people don't believe her side of the story enough.

I'm sorry, but a guy is going to be in a "certain condition" early in the morning, especially after being away from his loved one for awhile. This doesn't mean anything he does is ok, but the fact someone is ASLEEP has to be taken into consideration.

After her complaints to him, he said he was sorry(which is the part of the story she admittedly left out), but he said he didn't remember because he was asleep. She wouldn't believe this and made a big deal of it to the other team members.

I know the "I don't remember it" part sounds like an easy answer on his part, but as a guy, I will say I've done lots of things in my sleep I hope no one "holds against me"....no pun intended...LOL!

Anyone else see this?

[Sir Goulum]

Yea, I saw that! That was a lame excuse on his part!

[Ronn_Bman]

I have to be honest, I don't think it was so lame.

He should not have been asking to "hold" anyone with his pregnant wife waiting for him at home, but in the middle of the night, it's entirely possibly he may have reacted, in his sleep, to his body's desires. This is probably the reason guys don't "snuggle" with one another to keep warm. When you're asleep, you don't know anything, including the sex of the warm body beside you

If he's using it as an excuse, then of course, he's an A-hole, but I have to wonder, knowing he's being recorded 24/7, would he really take that chance? If something that bad, near rape as she said to one of her female tribe members, had happened wouldn't they have evidence. From a distance they can show you a wart on someone's toe, as it grows, over 41 days or so, I don't think they'd have missed this.

Also in his favor, once he found out what she was saying to the others he called a meeting of the tribe, and laid his story on the line. He thought things had been settled between them with his appology.

I don't think she's wrong for being upset about something she feels was inappropriate, but she's as stupid as him for agreed to hold/be held in the middle of nowhere by a stranger.

Bottom line, everyone acts involuntarily in their sleep to some greater or lesser degree.

[ 10-04-2002, 08:56 PM: Message edited by: Ronn_Bman ]

[Ladyzekke]

Read about that Ronn. Thought it pretty sicko for that guy to make his moves while she was asleep, with both of them being married no less! Plus I read that she had been raped before, so stiffened up when he was making his advances and pretending to be asleep, but that didn't bother him at all, he kept on for awhile. I also read that the next morning it all vented out of her, and eventually it led to her being voted off. Which is weird cause I'd think HE should have been voted off. Dunno if any of this is actually going to be aired though, I'd like to see some of what happened myself (not the groping part LOL, but the next day).

[Sir Goulum]

Originally posted by ladyzekke: Read about that Ronn. Thought it pretty sicko for that guy to make his moves while she was asleep, with both of them being married no less! Plus I read that she had been raped before, so stiffened up when he was making his advances and pretending to be asleep, but that didn't bother him at all, he kept on for awhile. I also read that the next morning it all vented out of her, and eventually it led to her being voted off. Which is weird cause I'd think HE should have been voted off. Dunno if any of this is actually going to be aired though, I'd like to see some of what happened myself (not the groping part LOL, but the next day).

LOL! I agree with LZ. Sure you'd get lonely, being away from your wife, but doing this?

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by ladyzekke: Read about that Ronn. Thought it pretty sicko for that guy to make his moves while she was asleep, with both of them being married no less! Plus I read that she had been raped before, so stiffened up when he was making his advances and pretending to be asleep, but that didn't bother him at all, he kept on for awhile. I also read that the next morning it all vented out of her, and eventually it led to her being voted off. Which is weird cause I'd think HE should have been voted off. Dunno if any of this is actually going to be aired though, I'd like to see some of what happened myself (not the groping part LOL, but the next day).

I haven't read anything about it yet, but I watched it Thursday night, and I'm going from what I saw on the episode, including her admission that she told everyone exactly what happened as she remembered it, except for his apology when she complained. She said that she regretted not telling that part of the story.

The fact that she had been raped undoubtably made it worse for her, but I have had many "experiences" while asleep or that, at least, started while I was asleep. Honestly, I'm not trying to be funny here. I absolutely believe she is upset, but I think her discounting his "I was asleep" may not be completely fair.

I'm very prone to talking in my sleep, I used to sleep walk quite a bit and still do occassionally, and I've done MUCH more interesting things while completely asleep.

I'm not saying he's right, and she's wrong. They both should have exercised more caution! If he consciously did what she claims, it boarders on the criminal, but I will say it's entirely possible his "excuse" isn't an excuse at all, but instead, it's actually the truth.

[Ronn_Bman]

Again, I'm not making light of ANY type abuse.

I'm just saying, based on personal experience with sleep activities, maybe he didn't consciously do it.

I realize my experiences represent the exception and not the rule. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 10-04-2002, 09:24 PM: Message edited by: Ronn_Bman ]

[Ladyzekke]

LOL Ronn I didn't know that about sleepshagging! I remember I slept walked when I was 10 a lot, but I grew out of it. But yes, I reckon maybe other people might also have that syndrome, and do things in their sleep.

I actually read about the whole thing in *blush* a rag, Enquirer or Globe or some such. Forgot my book today at work, can't eat lunch without reading material, it is just a thing about me LOL. Apparently also the girl's husband also thinks she may have played some part in the whole thing cause she allowed him to hold hands with her earlier that day (day of the "incident").

So I guess I see both sides. Perhaps they are both guilty. Still, you gotta admit the dude got way more forward than she did.

You know, I was listening to this radio station last week whilst driving to work, and this German girl called in, recently moved here to the U.S., 20 years old. She said that American men she has trouble making friends with. Said that they all want to be her boyfriend, or nothing. And in some ways that's true you know. If you befriend a man, talk to him a lot, smile and enjoy his presence, he automatically thinks you are hot for him, and pursues you, and when you don't want to have that kind of relationship and tell him, he then doesn't even want to talk to you at all anymore. It really IS very hard to find men that you can be JUST friends with. In other words, maybe that girl was really innocent, even when holding hands. Maybe she just was looking for companionship in a foreign environment, a friend, but he took it differently.

[Ronn_Bman]

Originally posted by ladyzekke: I guess I see both sides. Perhaps they are both guilty. Still, you gotta admit the dude got way more forward than she did. You know, I was listening to this radio station last week whilst driving to work, and this German girl called in, recently moved here to the U.S., 20 years old. She said that American men she has trouble making friends with. Said that they all want to be her boyfriend, or nothing. And in some ways that's true you know. If you befriend a man, talk to him a lot, smile and enjoy his presence, he automatically thinks you are hot for him, and pursues you, and when you don't want to have that kind of relationship and tell him, he then doesn't even want to talk to you at all anymore. It really IS very hard to find men that you can be JUST friends with. In other words, maybe that girl was really innocent, even when holding hands. Maybe she just was looking for companionship in a foreign environment, a friend, but he took it differently.

I really don't see her as guilty at all. Even if he does have the sleep shagging problem, it wasn't her fault that it happened. It was a poor decision on both sides to start the night that way, but she certainly wasn't "asking for it" or anything like that. It may have been as simple as he was asleep and didn't mean to do anything to her either. They may both be innocent but effected.

As far as the radio show, it's mostly true. ;( Guys have a hard time dealing with women they're attracted to as friends.