Party formation questions, all you studs who know alot feel free to comment:)

[Raistilyn]

Heya all, just quit EQ and wanted to play a game that brought back memories of the good ol days and this looks like the only new game out that catches my intrests.

First off, i have the game ordered, and will get it in like a week...which is way to long. I really want to get heads up on how the game works and already have about 10 hrs of web reading [img]smile.gif[/img] But i cant find a manual to read anywhere. Is there any chance any of you can copy/paste the manual and email me it or something...im assuming theres a manual file that comes with game. Id really appreaicate this, i need something factual to read for a change. Thanks,

Second i've been thinking about that party i want....the BIG descion. I always usually waste...well its not a waste i guess but still, like 20-30 hrs of playing games when i get to pick my party. I never played a M&M game that i didnt restart at least 3 times after playing for 30 + hrs heh. So im looking for some tips/ideas and schools of thought. I know every one has there own image, and its more about enjoying the game then having the "uber" class make up, i just want to avoid any serious potential problems. Ill give ya abit of what i like in my party and my early thoughts atm, and if you would be so kind as to give as much info as you want/can on the pro's and cons, and what you use, et.

My part so far: Fighter

Farie Ninja

Bard

Alright those are my 3 solid picks that im for sure using. Know i need help with the rest...

Magic users...
Debating just using one bishop for jack of all trades magic...which i rather not do....or more favorably go with a mage and then a bishop who is only at first a 2 school bishop, or 3 i guess. This way i have 2 portal castors correct? can the ninga get it also, if so thats 3 [img]smile.gif[/img] > Need help on what ya think for castors....

If i go with 2 castors, then my final spot should be a tank/damage dealer type im thinking. Maybe sam or monk or valk....any thoughts?

If i go one castor then i thought ranger for his auto search, and bow for those long battles, plus hed have abit of magic power also. TThat leaves me with one spot open in either case...so need help filling any important rolls im missing..

1) fighter, ninga,bard, mage, bishop , ?????

2) fighter, ninga, bard, ranger, bishop, ?????

If youd be so kind to suggest chars for both make ups it would be appreciated. Plz forgive me on any unaccurate assumtions or what not, i haven't even read the manual heh, just hear say from what people saying on the boards. Also , what do you guys think about class changes, via for my bard forsure. Also, is there more then one ending to this game or all the same? If i buy wiz 7 and play it and import chars does that drastically change the game, or just the start? Anyways thanks in advance for all your help.

[ratchild]

Everyone will say this...but... go with something you will enjoy. If you like an oriental flare to your party, go with a samurai or monk. Gadgeteers are definitely fun, and can cover the needs of a rogue type character. If you like a bit hitter, go with a Valk or fighter. not many people seem to like the lord, but i think they're all right. It's ultimately up to you.

[GenXCub]

1) Play the first time through with cookie cutter (so-called über parties) characters. The easiest way to do that is to pick the race which will give it's class 100's the quickest in the prime stats. You can play other variants after you get the hang of things.

My way of moving around is to just have the forward motion set to the arrow keys and then I hold the right mouse button down to pan side to side... so I'm always holding my right mouse button down (because then all you do is move your mouse to look up/down/left/right, etc.. a LOT easier than keyboard commands)

For your 6th member, it may be best to determine if you want a Melee party, or a Ranged party... a mix of the two doesn't really help you out any. So far I've built 2 fairly equal parties that I'm happy with. Sam-Fig-Ran-Gad-Bar-Bish, and Lor-Rog-Nin-Ran-Bar-Bish. I've been getting by okay with only one caster in the first party because the gadgeteer and the Bard may as well be Bishops that use stamina as their spellpoints... the verdict is still out on the 2nd, too early to decide.

Building 3 school Bishops is easy... Use your 9 level up points in the 3 schools you want... practice the spells to bring up the realm skills.

on your #2 party lineup, you could add a Gadgeteer to that party and you'd be a good Range attack party... very light on Melee (that can be solved by picking up Vi and RFS-81 though)

your #1 Party, I'm not so sure... Why have a Mage and a Bishop? you may as well go 2 bishops. It'll take longer to get to Level 7 spells, but at least you'll have access to a LOT more level 7 spells... also it'll give you 2 characters who can dispel undead. VERY useful that is in the early going since undead can be tough.

[Nightowl2]

For a first-time party, a good choice is two fighter-types up front, two spellcasters in back, one person to do lockpicking, and then fill out the remaining spot with whatever catches your fancy.

Personally, I'd go with two bishops for the spellcasters. I've tried it with other combinations of magic-users, and this has always been the most satisfactory for me. Bishops do develop more slowly, but they have such a great range with the magic, and are much more versatile than single-type spellcasters, that over time they become quite powerful (or as powerful as any spellcaster can be in this game).

Best to start with bishops rather than change class later. Development would be even slower, and I've been down that painful road. Wouldn't do it again.

Since you plan on having both a bard and a ninja, I'd say have your bard do the locks, so your ninja can concentrate on spells beginning 5th level.

Rangers are good for a first-time party because of their auto-scouting ability, finding all those hidden items. At higher levels, the instakills with bows comes in very handy.

Nightowl2

[Raistilyn]

Alright:
Fighter as the staple of the group
Farie ninja as my char that i just GOTA have [img]smile.gif[/img]
Bard for utility spells pretty much and rogue skills
Bishop for magic needs
Ranger for scouting, and some ranged attack even though my first time ill try to be more melee orientied.
So basically only suggestion for having another magic member is bishop you say...which i dont want another one heh, so i guess ill stick with one castor....can ninja get portal at all?
Last class probably should be a heaverier damage dealer, however im not really like the idea of another fighter....since my figher likes to have the attidude that the group and world revolves around him [img]smile.gif[/img] I dont think the 2 would play well togher heh.
So i am to chose from another ninja, rogue, sam, monk or valk...
Rogue kinda caught my intrest but kinda pointless since i dont really need his skills, how does backstab work though? DO i have to be behind them, or is it just a skill that makes him BS occasionlly or? Also of the 5 which can do the most damage out right? If the bishop is as good as you all say he is, i figure the bard/bishop can effectively handle the buff/debuff auxially spells for the group. Plus the farie ninja wont be doing much throwing, and will use some magic also , espeically if she can get portal.., Valk would be alright for damage and semi ability to tank, always nice to have fighter taking the front, and valk taking the flank or something, but how does her polearm damage compare to the other chars total damage? Im sure a few of her spells could be usefull but mainly need damage.
Also is it smarter to start the bishop out as a lvl 1 mage then switch right away that lvl to a bishop? That was suggested in some posts to me. Also should i plan on changing the bard at 18? And if so what char would best utilize his skills i gain the most and that will help that char? Well thanks for the advice

[GenXCub]

Anyone can learn the portal spell.. but it's 2 spells, Set Portal and Return to Portal... you either have to find both spellbooks, or choose on on level up. It's a level 5 spell, so your Ninja will have to be Level 16 to get it.

When you choose the spell on Level-up, it automatically gives you the other for free... but if you use the spellbook, you have to get both Set and Return as different books, learning one will not give you the other.

It can be quite difficult to get Ninjas up to that point though, you have to REALLY be diligent with getting his alchemy up high. Learn Heal Wounds and use it often instead of resting, or before resting.

For the other person, I'd still say use a Gadgeteer... the gadgets do great spells that won't use up mana (they use stamina which will regenerate on its own quickly). If you want to go more melee oriented, stick a Samurai in there. There are some good Samurai-only weapons in the game (the Muramasa), and Samurai-specific Armor... and they're the only other class that learns Wizardry (Mage) spells... that makes him REALLY easy to train as far as spells go because he can cast the Enchanted Blade / Missile Shield before combat instead of your Bishop to save spell points for offense.

As far as changing your bard at 18, you really may not need to do that... but if you do, it will depend on what you have built up skillwise by the time you get there... you don't want to turn him/her into a Fighter if you don't have any Close Combat / Melee Weapon skills, or don't turn him to a Ranger if you don't know Bows.. because you'll be a 1st level Ranger in a world full of 20th level monsters, and that hurts. Take a look at what you've learned by that point and change... you could even change to a Gadgeteer... when you class change to a Gadgeteer, you'll automatically get an Omnigun (though it's the crappy Mk 1, but at least you'll be able to start using some Gadgets... the Lightning Rod and Jack-in-the-box only require Level 1 Gadgeteer.

I'd go mostly for a Ranged character because that's what your bard is... casting spells from range... so your new class should be able to still do that.

Technically Fighters do more damage with polearms because they can berserk... Valks don't get anything special except 25% bonus points in polearms... but once that reaches 100, it doesn't count anymore, but Valks who have enough stamina can't be killed... when a valk hits 0 hit points but has enough stamina, she "cheats death" and just goes unconscious (and gets a few HP's), and loses a bunch of stamina.

Sorry for the length, but wanted to hit on all your points... oh, and There isn't much benefit to changing to a Bishop early, but it shouldn't hinder you much either.

[ice3]

For spellcasters go with a bishop. They simply gets much more horse power then other casters. Also you can develop them much longer.

I found out that you can train the 4 spell book very easily. Use all your developpement point into the 4 books and never put any in the realms. The realms goes up very fast.

Push psionic to level 15 (charm) or 30 then stop. From level 30 you can use mindread, this spell is just insane. At that level cast it two time with success will push up the mind realms and psionic book. In 10 minutes play you can have level 60 or more. I was just stunned when I tried.

[Raistilyn]

Appreciate the long post [img]smile.gif[/img]

I am starting to get concerned with my farie ninja...seems that the ninja might be better in back row tossing critical throws and stuf....how good is CoC...stats if you would be so kind heh. Will my ninja still critical kill or what not wiht it or does that skill only affect throwing weapons and bare hands?

Also with party formation, putting no one in front row allows you to set up your formation alot better correct, was reading some lil trick that allowed you to really maximize the effectiviness of a party buy not putting any one in the front row.

With bard, if i keep his bow skill up and get his sensi skill up can he make a effective ranger? Or will he always be better off using music then using ranged attacks?

Depending on how much i like the game, i will either lvl very high and try to get most of everything the first time threw or if not then ill try and beat it without trying to get all my chars super high. Then try some other combos and beating it again trying to get alot of the stuff i missed out on. A question, is there only one ending to the game? And does the imported chars give any diffrent ending or just a diffrent starting loc. God i want this game to get here heh, thanks all

[Raistilyn]

Bah i hate this waiting...ive been thinking and might revamp my strat...going straight melee based just seems...to easy??? So im considering a party that will have some spice, what about this heh..

pretty much a critical group base...

Samarii
Farie Ninja or maybe a better race and just have her throwing all the time no melee,
Monk
bard
ranger
XXXXX

This provides me with 4 people that can crit, and i figured i could have my bard maybe try and be healer if the last spot wasnt a caster.
Monk if developed right could probably be my main tank, no? If not i guess i could throw a valk or fighter in there as my 6th. Since all of them are critters, then i wouldnt have to worry about tying to have some one have the highest inititive to best utilize his crit attks. If i went with the fighter , could i survive? or would not having a castor screw me to much....maybe a bishop to tie all the lose ends up. Should i play with this, or stick with the origanl group since this one might take more skill and knowlege of the game to develope. Thoughts....

[ThorinOakshield]

I liked both your first groups you listed. For the first group for your 6th character I would have to recommed the ranger, I tried playing with out the ranger and having to use the search button I missed items and got surprised a lot in combat, the auto search is well worth the effort. I trained my Ranger as a front line fighter, On level ups I pumped the points into bow, ranged and alchemy. I allowed the close combt, dual weapons, sword, dagger, mace and flail to go up with use. I have a very powerful ranger this way, he can fight toe to toe or kill at range.

For your second group I would recommend a priest, lord or val. I am using a val in my party as my healer and her polearm skill allows me to have her on a flank to protect my Bishop. If you choose a priest I would recommed a dwarf for their natural damage restistance and put them in the front line as a fighter with a mace, your will get you divinty spells at the start instead of waiting for 5 level for the lord or val. I have tried the Lord but just can't seem to figure out how to correctly create him as a spell caster and a decent fighter.

The ninja is a awesome front line fighter and will get criticals in melee besides from thrown weapons, I can never keep enough thrown items for ammunition, so I would recommend against having the nija just throwing. Also, at higher levels mutliple attaks with martial arts do almost as much damage as my fighter.

Well there is my opinion. I would read each class in the manual when you get the game and choose what you want. Any combination in the game works, if you are lacking a skill you can pick up an NPC to fill that spot. I created probably 7 different partys before settling on a group.
I have a dwarven fighter, felpurr ninja, dracon val, mook ranger, rawulf gadgeteer, and a human bishop.