Anomen or Jaheira...which one is for me....getting more confused

[Darviathar]

Originally posted by BlackAssassin: Scimitars are pretty darn good. Wait until you get the spectral brand in ToB. THAT will change you opinion of scimitars. Besides who needs 25 strenght anyway. How the hell are you supposed to get anywhere near 1500 lbs in your pack. The closest i got was about 600 with illithium and golem parts and anked shell and armour.

I picked up the spectral brand scimitar the other night, and still don't have any desire to return Jahiera to my party. That scimitar isn't half the weapon that Crom Faeyr is, and Jahiera doesn't come close to Anomen in pure combat effectiveness. The Fire Giants were always thrilled to see her coming; they pounded her into mince nearly every battle that I tried to use her as a mainline tank. Anomen, on the other hand, easily holds his own and deals out brutal damage to everything I send him against. He now has five proficiency slots with the warhammer. Combine that with 25 strength, and there's no way any Jahiera character is going to measure up.

[Darviathar]

Originally posted by Cavern Sniffer: I'd take Jaheira all day long too. Clerics & Paladins are a dime a dozen, good Druids not so. Yes J takes a long time to level up but she's multi-classed and Druids take a while but their spells are awesome. Darviathar effectively has 4 tanks with 2 mages so yes you can happily offload J in that situation but as for armour I'm sorry but J can wear some of the very best that's out there. Give her a girdle of strength and she does like 18 odd damage with a +3 bullet, give her proficiency (increase it, she has it already) in spear and equip her with the Impaler that does +9 damage and she's a pretty awesome tank. Add to that her mage disruption, holding and healing spells and she is a great NPC. Slow starter, great finisher. Each to their own.

Jahiera was about 17th level as a fighter for me, wearing Firkraag's old suit, a girdle of stone giant strength, and wielding the impaler spear. She just wasn't cutting it for me. My other tanks were constantly having to pull off and assist her on her target of choice. Quite often the Fire Giants would knock her out in successive hits, despite an AC of about -7. Unlike my other tanks, she simply didn't have the HP's to hang on until I could gulp down a potion of super healing or pull her away in time to cast heal. I wanted to keep her around, but she simply wasn't cutting it as a tank OR a caster. Yeah, creeping doom is nice, but it is certainly nothing compared to comet or horrid wilting. For spell shock power I would have been better adding Nalia to my team at that point. Jahiera would be a much better character to me if she was a single class druid. At least then she would level quicker and have more spells. As it stands, she simply levels too slow to really occupy a character slot by the time TOB begins.

[Waluin]

I'm waiting for one of these discussions to finally devolve into simple shouting matches of people chanthing "No, Jaheira!" or "No, Anomen!"

which reminds me.

"GO JAHEIRA!"

[Kildus]

I play a beserker/cleric, so I don't need Anny. That makes it easy!

[Troll Slayer]

The most common argument for bringing Anomen into the party is he can wield Crom Fayer. I agree that Crom Fayer is a powerful weapon, and have enjoyed wielding it with many different characters in my many games, however I have come to the realization that perhaps it is not as "good" as people think it is. Its two big advantages are it's a +5 weapon (nifty for hitting liches and such) and it gives the wielder 25 strength. Looks great on the surface right? Well think about what it's costing you to make Crom Fayer....

Little Spoilers.........I warned ya

To make Crom Fayer you need to have the following components....
1. Gauntlets of ogre strength
This means you must have completed the entire planer sphere quest to get them

2. Hammer of thunderbolts.
This means you must have done the firekrag quest and gotten the key off one of his henchmen to enter the secret entrance in the sewers under the temple distract and ran through a gauntlet of mind flayers.

3. Scroll of Crom Fayer
This little item is located on the shadow dragon, meaning the completion of the Umar hills quest.

4. Finally you need to get the girdle of ?frost/stone? giant strength (one of them cant remember which). Which is found after spell hold in the underdark.

So you cannot even get From Fayer till chapter 6 of the game. And since you had to complete just about every "tough" quest to get it many of its components, there is very few really large and hard quest left from chapter 2 or 6 to do. Yes there are a few nice battles that you may have left till after you get Crom Fayer, but most are easier then the quest fights that you completed to get many of the components of the hammer.

All this means that you have complete over half the game, if you have ToB, or over ¾ if you just have SoA. Being that you get the hammer so late, to me that diminishes it value slightly. Also, you have to give up some pretty good equipment to make it. You could have 1 person with 25 strength, or 2 people one with 18/00 and another with 21. Add in the girdle of hill and stone giant, and you can have 4 party members with strength of at least 18/00, if you do not amke the hammer There are tons of potions that improve strength, and even a few other items (I won't mention them or by how much, as not to spoil). To me, its important to have 4 members of my group with that strength, 4 people should be enough to cover anyone who would ever be fighting. Mages and pure Druids, thieves etc usually do not need such high strength. Finally I must say the hammer of thunderbolts is no shabby weapon itself. Good enough for me to want to use the hammer if I am proficient in it. Well at least till I get some ToB hammers. In short I feel that Crom Fayer being wielder by Anomen is just not worth what it costs to the rest of the group. If your #1 tank was using it, then I see its value. However, I know that for most people, Anomen is not their groups #1 tank. So to simply take Anomen because he can use a certain weapon is simply not worth it. Jaheria on the other hand can get some really good weapons in chapter 2 - 4. Blem, the impaler, staff of air, and staff of striking are just a few. Add in a belt of strength of some kind, and she can be a good BACKUP tank. She just like Anomen, will never be the best tank in the game. In short, I feel that if you already have a cleric then take jaheria, if not go for Anomen. My feelings of course exclude the considerations of NPC conversation and romance, and just look at things from their value in combat.


[This message has been edited by Troll Slayer (edited 07-13-2001).]

[Waluin]

Thanks Trollslayer, that is by far the best and most fair arguement and evaulation I do believe I have ever seen on the matter. In addition, I believe it to be the most correct as well.

Oh, and welcome to the board!

[Troll Slayer]

Thanks for the warm welcome. It has been a while since I was a member of any BG message boards, but with ToB out, I'm all up for BG disscussions again.

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Best to remain silent and thought a fool, then to open ones mouth and remove all doubt

[Cavern Sniffer]

Personally I've always thought Crom what For was a waste of time and items. I've never built it, seen it or used it. Troll Slayers points are valid and mirror my own concerning this weapon.

P.S. Jaheira's better than Amen.

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It's bleedin dark down here, slippery too.
Man, that's a pisser.

[Mellagar]

I think it all depends on how you manage both Jaheira and Anomen. They're both extremely good NPC's and everytime I play SOA and TOB I take em both. Between Anomen's army of Skeletal Warriors and Jaheira's Elemental and insect hordes their ain't much to stand in the way. Besides once you get to TOB Jaheira can summon giant Elementals and celestial beings. Anomen has the sunray ability which saved my butt when I was fighting Bohdi in the final showdown. That stunt wiped out everything in the room lol. As for weapons I had Jaheira wearing the armor I got from the Underdark and dual weilding +3 scimitars. She starting surpassing Misnc when it came to choppin down unfriendlies in combat. Between dual weilding and the +3 sling with +3 ammo, she got to be pretty tough overall. So I'd have to say Jaheira was one tough fighter and an excellent backup when in rough scraps. Anomen has the fireball from the sky thing going which clears out a room and if you build up his mace skill and dual weilding he becomes a mincer in comabt, heh. So like I said its all in how you manage them. Give em lame spells and crappy armor with pathetic weapons and yeah, your gonna have a couple of dolts running your party. Course overall I'd say Jaheira stands just above Anomen, character wise of course, but both are great NPC's.

[Mellagar]

Oh yeah.....Jaheira's better, heh.