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Old 10-05-2000, 05:23 PM   #1
MrCreosote
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This really is a pile of doggie pooh. As a loyal Wizardry fan I have long awaited this release and what a dissapointment it is. No wonder it was so tough to get a publisher to take it on board, and it wont sell, and this is the end of Wizardry as a series, sad but you blew it pal.

Do you really think it acceptable to produce a product that has the following OBVIOUS problems:-

Multiple mouse clicks to do the most basic of things like save and load, and you have to save and lkoad often in this game. Why was it so hard to give a standard "Q" Quicksave ? Couldnt be bothered is probably the answer.
Spell casting system that stinks, its just too cumbersome.
No facility to go to phased time for ranged attacks, thus all ranged weapons are useless and so is most offensive spell casting.
Interface that requires too much dexterity i.e. menus on left and right of screen, left mouse look and right mouse move, this isnt RPG its a first person shoot em up.
Basic errors in design such as not being able to see the items in chests so you just mess around grabbing everything, so lacks excitement when you open a chest as you dont see whats in it.
Appalling graphics, trees and bushes floating in mid-air, painted background like someting from the 1970s. Naff butterflies copied from Ultima, come to think of it, it does look like a poor man's version of Ultima Ascension.
Poor Win98 interface i.e. cant alt/Esc back to desktop without losing the game.

I could go on for hours but whats the point. Did ANYONE play test this thing ?? Like others in this forum I have been playing RPGs since they were invented, I ve played great through to dreadful, and Wizardry 7 was always my favorite.

I am gut wrenched with dissapointment. It has some lovely touches but I just cant be bothered trying to use this dreadful interface. Well, thats me out of wizardry and I guess there will be others, maybe many of them. This game is destined to fail.

I'll give you a clue how I feel. I loaded Baldurs Gate 2 this weekend whilst I was awaiting this game and when it arrived I deleted BG2, this evening I am deleting this crap and putting BG2 back. I am no fan of BG but it is oodles better than this pile of shit. I would have been happy with another Wizardry using the same old engine !! but this contrived Ultima copy just isnt Wizardry RPG.

MrC
 
Old 10-05-2000, 05:34 PM   #2
Delmax
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BAHH..

This is a great game...All I hear is folking crying about this and that..I have absolutely no problems with this game..and I this game so far has the potential to rival Bane of the Cosmic Forge..(My all time favorite RPG)...

Some of your points are just your point of view of course..for example..the range combat(as it is now) is great...why goto turn based..I would hate it for range combat.and I think alot of folks will agree to this..If I had to go into phase combat for range combat...it would be alot tougher..that is for sure..

I have no problem with the spell system..It functionally great as is..You have the basic spells that you need..enough said..and they are fast to get too!

Yea..there are a few bugs in the game..but those will get fixed..with time...None of the bugs are messing up my game play..that is for sure.

GREAT JOB BRADLEY..you the MAN!
 
Old 10-05-2000, 06:05 PM   #3
Bigdog
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What I don't understand is how people are so harsh on this game. They must have expected alot. Okay I will not argue that the saving and reloading is tedious. (one thing to consider is that since you can interchange party members create new parties the save has to be somewhat complex). The rerolling your character is annoying but on the 1hp, 1ability point thing what I have realized is that you NEED to advance to elite class the game expects it of you. Early classes just stop giving you anything worthwhile at about lvl 6-7 so you should be to your first elite class by then. Once you have gone elite you'll notice you only have to reroll once maybe twice and you'll hit that 21hp increase (and boy does it feel good). (sorry to get off subject=)). The spell casting system of getting mauled while you switch spells bothers me too but outside of battle i don't see a problem, solution pick your powerful spell before you go into battle and use it or run away during battle slightly and switch. I would *HATE* if the ranged attacking were turned base (but I do play 1st person shooters, so It might be easier for me). Next point, when I open up a chest I can see the sword, guantlets, rings etc... maybe you just have a graphics glitch... Lastly the graphics suck? thats another thing that amazes me, now I don't argue D3D problems but comparing these graphics to other massive RPG's out there these are pretty damn good! Oh well have fun with BG2 =).
 
Old 10-05-2000, 06:22 PM   #4
Scronan
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I'd like to say I this W&W is an awesome game. True, there have been a few problems, but I've played a lot of RPG's, yes for 15 years I'll admit it. The first one I played was called Dungeons of Daggorath on a Tandy Color Computer 2, the hardest RPG I have EVER played. It was even 3D and real time combat in a crude way, back in the mid 80's. If any of you remember this game, then you're a sad case like myself.

My point is, back then I only dreamed about games like this. I know there are lots on the market, but I think a lot of people like the new flashy types of games and don't remember the old favourites that started what we call today an "RPG". I know it all started with TSR stuff, but W&W has the old time feel that made me love Bard's Tale and other series, yet with some new technology and ideas.

Yes, it has a few rough spots, but think what DW Bradley has done. He's off on his own and forging a new path with his own ideas. That takes a lot of time, courage and hard work to produce. I've coded text based RPG's, and let me say as some of you who also have done this, it surely ain't easy. I spent YEARS with design and many long hours to make the end product.

I'm not one to be sold on flashy graphics, and just because everyone is buying a game does not mean it is the best. What is "best" is really a matter of personal choice, and for me, W&W is exactly what I'm looking for, which is a game I can sink my teeth into. Surely, all of our concerns will be adressed in the second game, don't forget this is a brand new series. I think some of you are being way too harsh and accomplishing nothing. If you don't like a game like this, then don't just vent about it, you're just wasting your time and energy and making an ass of yourself. Theres a lot of RPGs out there, so just find something more to your liking. We've all played games we don't like, and ones that we do.

Without going into detail, I think game is just awesome. I've heard a lot of people on the list really express their dislike of the game. Hey, this game wont appeal to everyone, but don't take it out on this forum. I think a lot of you are being way too negative and just making a scene here.

BTW, I was wondering, anyone else care to share their like of the game?

Great game I say, I love it. I blasted through Diablo 2 in one weekend, but this one I've been 4 times the playtime into already, and I've only just passed the crypt.

That's serious RPGing for me.

I'm happy with it.

Scronan
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Old 10-05-2000, 08:13 PM   #5
BlackFiend
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I've been reading most of the W&W boards now for over a week. And I've read the few reviews out. The initial impression is always the same: it's exactly what you stated.

The people who hang in there and deal with some of the annoying problems actually find a good game underneath. I don't blame people for having to find a diamond in the rough. But the consensus is that the core game itself is actually pretty good.

Anyway, I finished BG2 yesterday. It's a 5 start game so have fun. I don't find much replay value in it, so you might be installing W&W sooner than you think
 
Old 10-05-2000, 10:32 PM   #6
warmonger3
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I love this game. Every game has it's drawbacks, and that does not make me like it any less.
 
Old 10-06-2000, 12:16 AM   #7
Paupa
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I am very interested in this thread because I have been pondering buying W&W. Should I buy it?
If you answer me would you please name a couple of your favorite RPGs so I can have a gauge on how similar our tastes are. My favorite RPGs go back to Bards Tale and Ultima Underworld, and recently I liked Elder Scrolls and Fallout. Thanks for any help.
 
Old 10-06-2000, 02:57 AM   #8
warmonger3
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Wizardry, Everquest, Demise, Might&Magic series, early Ultima games, and old gold box games. I would recommend that if you love role playing games, buy this one. Mr. Bradley has done A fine job, and zero decent first person games have been released recently. Be warned the downside to the game, and my only complaint is the dungeon puzzles are to obscure, and there are few tips in the game getting to the objective of each dungeon. Maybe the final puzzle, yes, but no tips on how to get from square y to square x, if that makes any sense.
 
Old 10-06-2000, 08:50 AM   #9
MrCreosote
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I do agree with the postings that there is probably a good game underneath the failures in the control system and flakiness of the game engine etc but it really is a struggle to come to enjoy the thing. Basic failures like the number of clicks it takes to save and load, and one does a LOT of this in WW, I mean, who on earth decided that one has to quit from a game with all the resultant "are you sure" before allowing a saved game to be loaded ? This is symptamatic of the whole game, it has some great concepts but a lousy implementation. I also have a major problem with it being so DARK, I have gamma turned right up, my screen turned right up and still I cant see treasure chests etc lurking in corners of the room, and have torchlight spells and EVERYONE holding a torch !

If you are thinking of buying the game my advice would be get it from a supplier who allow returns - you may love it, or you may be driven to frustration by its anomolies and failures.
Oh, and the puzzles are VERY obscure.

MrC
 
Old 10-06-2000, 09:16 AM   #10
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First off, let me say that I've been playing CRPGs since the late 80's starting with Bard's Tale and the SSI Gold Box games. I think that Wizard's & Warriors accomplishes what it set out to do -- to modernize the classic RPG. No game is perfect and even very good ones have flaws.

Can anyone here remember the horrible memory leaks in Daggerfall? (I nicknamed the game Daggercrash in my utter frustration) Does anyone remember the disappearing car trunk in Fallout 2?

What's important to me in a CRPG is that I feel connected to the characters by guiding their growth (selecting their skills, their equipment, etc.) and that I feel a part of the story.

Anyone else enjoy the text parser? I love getting that new bit of information by typing a keyword that's not in the list. I actually feel like I'm interacting with the NPCs.

Anyway, I find the game enjoyable and that's all that really counts. I'm willing to put up with the shortfalls of any game as long as it remains a challenge and entertaining.
 
 


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