Suicide. Why not?

[Sir ReGiN]

Originally posted by Melusine: Ummm Regin, I'm actually agreeing with you, read my post again. So I'll repeat; I do feel that people have the right to decide whether they want to live or die, BUT I am not advocating the societal indifference some people display. Giving the people the right to decide to commit suicide doesn't mean we don't CARE if they commit suicide! What's wrong with trying to help them overcome their suicidal tendencies. Usually, the people that we are able to help are the ones that WANT help anyway, the ones who've already decided won't be discovered until it's too late.

Oh, I wasn't attacking you Melusine, I simply used your post as an example. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

And once again, I'm not talking about people with temporary depressions or who had some misfortunes, I'm talking about people who have given it alot of thought, who have talked to others and that have found that the best alternative is death.

[Melusine]

Originally posted by Sir ReGiN: Oh, I wasn't attacking you Melusine, I simply used your post as an example. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear. And once again, I'm not talking about people with temporary depressions or who had some misfortunes, I'm talking about people who have given it alot of thought, who have talked to others and that have found that the best alternative is death.

I wasn't saying you were attacking me either, Regin.

Truth is, the people you talk about are rare. People who are otherwise healthy but have a sincere and deeprooted deathwish don't stand around talking to other people: they just do it. The ones who DO say they want to die more often than not are still looking for a way to enjoy life once more, looking for help.
Unless you're talking about terminally or chronically ill people, but that's euthanasia, which is permitted in my country and therefore less of an issue for me. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Sir ReGiN]

Originally posted by Melusine: I wasn't saying you were attacking me either, Regin. Truth is, the people you talk about are rare. People who are otherwise healthy but have a sincere and deeprooted deathwish don't stand around talking to other people: they just do it. The ones who DO say they want to die more often than not are still looking for a way to enjoy life once more, looking for help. Unless you're talking about terminally or chronically ill people, but that's euthanasia, which is permitted in my country and therefore less of an issue for me. [img]smile.gif[/img]

well, you have a point. I agree that they are rare, but is it because of society's view on suicide? That people that have a "healthy" view on suicide are considered strange and terrible people, and therefore not many talk about their views (eeh..do you follow?).
Two questions arise; why is it so taboo to commit suicide? And should it stay that way or not?

well, to a certain extent, if suicide WAS legal, a lot more people would take the "easy way out". Truth is (and I know this is an opinion) they would come out all the stronger for it be living through it

And, if suicide was easy, they would not get this chance

btw, am I the only one reminded of the song "Suicide is Painless" (theme tune for M.A.S.H)

(My opinion)
I believe in the Bible and one of the Ten Commandments is "Thou Shalt Not Kill".
I believe that includes ourselves.
My sympathy goes out to the terminally ill and aged who have to endure lives that don't seem like they are worth living but there could be some important life's lesson in the very last natural moment of it that has significant meaning to one's soul and to deprive yourself of it could have even more negative consequences than having lived it through. I am not referring to "burning in Hell" although there is the possibility that it (or just going to Hell) could be one of the consequences, but to the possibility of reincarnation and coming back from one miserable life to live another one that is even worse.

[ 08-25-2002, 11:33 AM: Message edited by: Moni ]

[Farscry]

It's always struck me as odd that suicide is a crime. I mean, what're police going to do, walk up to a corpse and arrest it?

Now, before you think I'm all desensitized and all, I went through a suicidal period of my own once... actually twice. I was brought around (in large part due to the fact that I just didn't want to put my loved ones through the consequences of my own selfish actions), but I figure that it's still someone's right to do with their life as they see fit.

Yes, I'm Christian, and no, I don't think God would approve of me taking my own life. But, I don't feel right in imposing my beliefs on others. If someone is going to come around, they'll do it without me forcing them to agree with my beliefs against their will.

[Attalus]

I believe that the law merely shows this society's disapproval of it, as an example of the belief that ultimate good is life. Not that in some societies, it is not considered a praiseworthy thing under the right circumstances. The Romans and the Japanese, to take just two examples, considered it almost noble, if it were done as an act of protest or apology. The Christian Church has always abhorred it, at one time refusing burial on consecrated ground for suicides. This was because suicide was considered the ultimate manifestation of the capital sin of Despair, the rejection of God's Grace as manifested by the Holy Spirit. It was actually referred to as "the Rejection of the Holy Spirit, the one unforgivable sin." (St. Thomas Acquinas, I believe)

[Melusine]

Interesting read Attalus! [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]

You often hear people joking about suicide being against the law, like "what are they going to do, sentence me to death?"
But I guess the law does apply for most cases, which are suicide ATTEMPTS. I have no stats on this but I imagine there are a lot more suicide attempts than there are successful suicides. And I know I said I believe in the right to decide about your own life, but I also know that a severe depression can cloud your judgement to the point where you really are incapable of making the right decision. A lot of people who've attempted suicide are immensely grateful later on to the person who saved them. While I don't think suicide should be illegal, I imagine that's the underlying thought of such a law: it gives medics and professionals the legal back-up to help suicide-attemptees refind their will to live.

[Chewbacca]

Voluntary discorporation is illegal because of Religious taboo.

I think the fear that death is permanent or that punishment awaits in the afterlife drives the suicide taboo. I dont believe in either. If I were to discorporate right now. I believe I would be a free spirit, aware of , but unseen in the physical realm. Suicide is way less fearful and taboo if we all live beyond our body anyway.

Ultimately it is my life and if I'm gonna end it its mine to do so. It just makes it more exciting that someone would actually try to stop me.

Which brings me to the point that most suicide ATTEMPTS aren't suicide attempts but a way of communicating pain that is unbearable. Pleas for help.

Most suicide SUCCESSES are just that...voluntary discorporation as a means to end unbearable pain.

[Melusine]

True Chewbacca, that's why I stressed that in the case of an attempt, it WILL almost always be worthwhile to try and help that person: they most likely did not really, not deeply want to die.

[ 08-25-2002, 12:28 PM: Message edited by: Melusine ]