Town to fine for foreign flags

[Dreamer128]

The Nevada town of Pahrump is taking a stand not just against illegal immigrants but flags they may bring with them.

The elected town board in the remote Mojave Desert community voted 3-2 on Tuesday to enact an ordinance making it illegal to fly a foreign nation's flag by itself.

Flying another country's flag, whether it is a British Union Jack or the flag of Mexico, is punishable by a $50 fine and 30 hours' community service, unless it is flown below an American flag.

"Old Glory is sovereign," says Paul Willis, a retired carpenter and board member. "You can't fly any other nation's flag higher than the American flag."

The American Civil Liberties Union says the flag restriction violates the First Amendment's guarantee of free speech.

"There's no doubt about it," says Lisa Rasmussen, a board member of the Nevada ACLU. "People have a right, as much as we don't like it, to fly ... any flag they wish."

Pahrump is a rural fast-growing town of 33,000 about 60 miles west of Las Vegas. It is part of sprawling Nye County, home of the closest legal brothels to Las Vegas.

The law passed as part of a package of measures that also declared English the official language of Pahrump and denies town benefits to illegal immigrants.

"We don't have any" benefits, town manager David Richards says. "If we ever have any, they'll be denied to illegal immigrants."

Supporters say the law is a stand on principle and doubts anyone will be arrested for violating it.

"I can't conceive of there being anyone cited for it," said board Chairman Richard Billman, who voted against the ordinance.

The ordinance's sponsor, Michael Miraglia, a retired Illinois state worker, said the flag restriction was a reaction to nationwide demonstrations in May against a crackdown on illegal immigration. He said he didn't like seeing protesters waving Mexican flags and demanding immigrants not go to work that day.

"In Pahrump, we had Mexican restaurants closed that day," he complained. "Only one restaurant stayed open."

Rasmussen said the ACLU would probably take legal action against the town.

"People are nuts out there," she says. "Totally nuts."

(Source: USAToday)

[johnny]

I guess the Olympics won't be coming to Nevada any time soon then.

[Cerek]

The American Civil Liberties Union says the flag restriction violates the First Amendment's guarantee of free speech.

"There's no doubt about it," says Lisa Rasmussen, a board member of the Nevada ACLU. "People have a right, as much as we don't like it, to fly ... any flag they wish."

Typical knee-jerk reaction by the ACLU. Ms. Rasmussen's declaration is wrong because she overlooks the fundamental point being made by the Pahrump town council. "People" don't have an inherent right to display the flag of their choice....CITIZENS OF THE U.S. are granted the right to free speech by our Constitution. But the rights granted by the Constitution DO NOT APPLY to illegal immigrants.

The law passed as part of a package of measures that also declared English the official language of Pahrump and denies town benefits to illegal immigrants.

I'm sure Ms. Rasmussen will attack this measure as well, but again, this is aimed at immigrants who have entered the country illegally.They are not citizens of the U.S. and cannot claim the rights granted by the Constitution or benefits bestowed by the community when they refuse to follow the laws of the country.

[Havock]

I am with Cerek on this one. Maybe the town should change the penalty from a fine to DEPORTATION!! Just roll up on the house and tell the people, "O.K. you like mexico so much, we are going to ship you back there." I mean they are breaking the law just by wakeing up in the morning, or did the ACLU forget the meaning of illegal when it is put in front of immigrant.

[Yorick]

That's ridiculous. And what if you're a tourist visiting to support your team play against America. Would a whole stadium of Brazilian soccer fans be arrested for refusing to wave a US flag over the Brazillian one?

[Yorick]

Or a native American wanting to fly a flag.
If Aboriginal Aussies want to fly their flag instead of the Aussie flag, power to them!

[Felix The Assassin]

Well now, it appears that the ACLU might want to do a little bit of research in and around US flag etiquette. Extracted from the US Code: Flags; Article 11:

11. When flags of two or more nations are displayed, they are to be flown from separate staffs of the same height. The flags should be of approximately equal size. International usage forbids the display of the flag of one nation above that of another nation in time of peace. The order of precedence for flags generally is National flags (US first, then others in alphabetical order in English), State (host state first, then others in the order of admission) and territories (Washington DC, Puerto Rico, etc.), Military (in order of establishment: Army, Marine Corps, Navy, Air Force, Coast Guard), then other.

[Cerek]

Originally posted by Yorick: That's ridiculous. And what if you're a tourist visiting to support your team play against America. Would a whole stadium of Brazilian soccer fans be arrested for refusing to wave a US flag over the Brazillian one?

You're comparing apples to apricots, Yorick. The law is specifically designed to target immigrants residing in the town, not tourists that are just passing through. As I said before, the rights granted by the Constitution DO NOT apply to those who are breaking the law by residing in the country illegally. The only "right" illegal immigrants are inherently granted is safe transport back to the border from whence they came.

I concede the law is flawed because it could also be used against LEGAL immigrants who wish to fly the flag of their home country. I would agree with the ACLU that LEGAL immigrants should have the right to fly their homeland flag, but I would add the caveat that they should also follow the Constitution and fly the American flag as well. After all, it IS America that is giving them the benefits they are reaping by being citizens here.

[Iron Greasel]

Originally posted by Cerek: The law is specifically designed to target immigrants residing in the town, not tourists that are just passing through.

I read that thingy twice. Where does it say that?

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Cerek: I concede the law is flawed because it could also be used against LEGAL immigrants who wish to fly the flag of their home country. I would agree with the ACLU that LEGAL immigrants should have the right to fly their homeland flag, but I would add the caveat that they should also follow the Constitution and fly the American flag as well. After all, it IS America that is giving them the benefits they are reaping by being citizens here.

Hi Cerek. [img]smile.gif[/img]

A legal immigrant is not a citizen. A ledal immigrant (resident alien) are nationals of their own country, who should have every right to fly their own flag if they want. They're here paying taxes, building the US economy, legally here, but and for whatever reason without the benefits of citizenship.

Would you expect every citizen of the United States who spends a year working for a US company in say... Argentina, to fly Argentinitan flags? Would you ask technical advisors to petroleum companies in Ghana to NOT fly their US flag if they want?

Not all aliens in the US are immigrants, not all immigrants become citizens, and of the aliens and immigrants (including myself) that I know, none are here illegally, nor speak Spanish, nor are from Mexico, yet the said law would ban me/us from flying our Aussie/British/South African/Canadian flags at sporting events or anything.

I don't see how that's fair if we are here within the law at the invitation of the United States helping to build the US economy (and already being taxed without representation. )

[ 11-18-2006, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: Yorick ]