God Made Me Do It

[Azred]

News story is here.

In short, Deanna Laney, a 39-year-old mother living in Tyler, TX received messages from God that she should kill her children--on Mother's Day Weekend last year--to test her faith and become a witness after the end of the world. Thus, she beat the brains out of two of her children with a rock and maimed the third in his crib.

What the f***?! [img]graemlins/madhell.gif[/img]

from the article: Defense attorneys argued that insanity was the only reason why a deeply religious mother who homeschooled her children would kill two of them and maim another without so much as a tear.

Just as with Andrea Yates, why hasn't anyone yet seen that "deeply religious" people who never get out of the house seem to have a higher probability of mental disturbances? Being cooped up with little children 24 hours a day would drive anyone crazy.
Belle has been criticized at times for being a working mother, as if that is somehow less desirable than being a stay-at-home mother. Well, I haven't seen any news stories of working mothers killing their children, so which is worse?

Apparently no one, including her husband of 19 years Keith, her brother who is a minister, her friends, other relatives, or acquaintances from her church saw that she had any mental problems. Bulls****! [img]graemlins/idontagreeatall.gif[/img] Nobody wanted to do anything because they were more worried about the stigma of "mental illness" than potential harm to either herself or her children.

Anyway, she will now be committed to a state psychiatric hospital and, pending medical evaluations, will eventually be released. [img]graemlins/erm.gif[/img] This could be within 5 years, at which point she will probably stop taking her medication--"I'm all better now"--and relapse into her psychotic dissocative state. Joy.

The second worst thing about this tragedy is the overall defense strategy: God told me to do it. [img]graemlins/saywhat.gif[/img] If you don't want to take responsibility for your actions, just become deeply religious and claim that God was testing your faith. Simple.

[ 04-04-2004, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: Azred ]

[Dreamer128]

I guess every murderer could make such a claim. So unless god comes down to testify at her trial, insanity is probably her best bet. Has she pled guilty?

[ 04-04-2004, 11:44 AM: Message edited by: Dreamer128 ]

[Azred]

No. The jury has already reached its verdict: not guilty by reason of insanity. Why can't that be turned into "guilty by reason of insanity", with subsequent sentencing to a psychiatric hospital instead of a regular prison? That way they are still found guilty and can also get the medical assistance they obviously need without being thrown to the wolves in regular prison. [img]graemlins/1ponder.gif[/img]

[john]

And why not mandatory sterilization as well.So when she gets out she can't start all over again.

[Oblivion437]

Well, forced sterylizing of a group would be inhumane, but particular individuals such as this one clearly aren't in a position to raise children...

Now, one thing I think that's misunderstood, is that one of the hardest pleas to prove is insanity. Testimony has to be brought together that is harder to arrange, and rings loudly immaterial and irrelevant to most juries.

In this case, what has to be taken into account is, that it's very unlikely it was as simple as saying, "God made me do it!" and walking off. Chances are a hell of a show was put on for the jury, including 'random' fits or whatever. It wouldn't surprise me a tiny bit that there would be elaborate choreography and staging planned well before trial began to insure the likely belief that this woman is out of her mind. I'm not saying she likely is, I'm saying it's very likely to be seen that way, due to the elaborate tricks lawyers would employ.

Another thing to note, is that a defendant, as a person doesn't have to say one word or get on the stand unless called by the prosecution. A plea of insanity, guilt, innocence, no contest or whatever is entered, is done so by the council unless the defendant represents themselves. In the US, due to 'right of attorney' this is rarely the case, and sometimes, individuals are ordered by the judge to retain council when they opt out of the court appointed attorney's services. If one is stuck with a court-appointed attorney, getting one's own lawyer or studying the law heavily to bring up certain points on one's own will likely be necessary, as appointed lawyers have a nasty habit of not giving a damn about their appointees.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Azred: Just as with Andrea Yates, why hasn't anyone yet seen that "deeply religious" people who never get out of the house seem to have a higher probability of mental disturbances? Being cooped up with little children 24 hours a day would drive anyone crazy.

Azred two examples out of millions does not make a higher probability. There are people all over this world that do things for Lord only knows what reasons.

Most of the people that inhabit this planet are like breakfast cereal, what's not flakes, is fruits and nuts

[Azred]

You have a point, John. I was simply stating that the truly headline-grabbing cases of maternal pedicide seem to fall into two general categories: 1) mothers who smother newborn infants and discard the remains and 2) stay-at-home mothers who seem to "snap". I know that those are generalizations (and all generalizations are bad, including this one) yet a kernel of truth is nevertheless there. There is a higher-than-normal incidence of mothers home-schooling their children in the area where I live; thus, this case opens a potentially dangerous door, because it is only a matter of time before this town experiences its first murder....

I am still curious that apparently no one saw any signs pointing out that something was wrong before events became irreversible. How can you not know that someone is losing touch with reality, especially when you are around that person on an almost daily basis, unless you don't want to see it? She was in a church; didn't they have any sort of support structure in place to help?

Finally, Ms. Laney claimed that she was receiving messages from God. [img]graemlins/erm.gif[/img] Exactly how did she know that the messages were indeed from God? Did he show her his official two forms of identification? Blood sample taken for DNA scan, was it? *knock* *knock* "Hello, I'm God, and I have a message for you...."

[Timber Loftis]

Posted about this elsewhere. To summarize:

She will be in the mental ward until well. Could be 1 year (doubtful given the crime), could be 10, could be forever.

And, I am surprised a Texas jury, normally "tough on crime," let her get away with it.

In addition, I note I hope this does not bode ill for home schooling, a perfectly reasonable schooling program that has resulted in many bright students I(I know one lawyer who was home schooled, his designer brother, and MIT grad, who was home schooled, and my three little cousins, one of whom is a music whiz - competing nationally - all of whom were home schooled).

[Yorick]

Originally posted by John D Harris: quote: Originally posted by Azred: Just as with Andrea Yates, why hasn't anyone yet seen that "deeply religious" people who never get out of the house seem to have a higher probability of mental disturbances? Being cooped up with little children 24 hours a day would drive anyone crazy.

Azred two examples out of millions does not make a higher probability. There are people all over this world that do things for Lord only knows what reasons.

Most of the people that inhabit this planet are like breakfast cereal, what's not flakes, is fruits and nuts [/QUOTE]I wrote this before your reply John, but the site had a timeout and I was unable to post it. The matter seems moot now, but I may as well post it anyway.....


====
Azred,

A "deeply religious person" as you put it, if Christian, would be reading the WORD of God, so that if they think that they hear God tell them something, they can crossreference it against the bible. They can also, check with their pastor, and see if he's hearing the same word of God for their life.

Those two elements - reading the bible, and having a relationship with a Pastor, are what prevents wierd and destructive behaviour like this.

So please, before tarring all of us who have faith, consider the abberation factor. How many people in America claim to know God? How many believe God tells them to kill their children?

The other aspect your ignoring is that she's American. I could quite easily slander your people and say "that's typical American lunatic violence. When will people realise that Americans left to their own devices are violent nutcases". Does that help?

Consider also she's a mother. We could make slurring comments about women too. That they are more emotional, and especially with post natal depression and periods, more prone to lunacy like this.

Are any correct? Can we generalise about people of faith, Americans or women? C'mon Azred. Her defense didn't wash. She was found to be insane and will spend 40 odd years in an asylum. If that's the jury's verdict that's good enough for me.

[Skunk]

Originally posted by Azred: The second worst thing about this tragedy is the overall defense strategy: God told me to do it. [img]graemlins/saywhat.gif[/img] If you don't want to take responsibility for your actions, just become deeply religious and claim that God was testing your faith. Simple. [/QB]

I wouldn't discount the idea that she honestly believed this - it's not for nothing that she's been sent to a psychiatric hospital.

But the verdict sends an odd statement to the world, does it not? You are not insane if you believe in god, but you are insane if you think that he talks to you...

But I won't go any further than that or this'll get too close to the religion ban.