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Old 03-09-2002, 07:19 PM   #1
/)eathKiller
Dracolisk
 

Join Date: January 5, 2002
Location: Guantanamo Bay, Cuba
Age: 38
Posts: 6,043
Well, you guessed it, I went right on over to Red XIII's house and then over to a house of his, and to our bewilderment more freinds showed up and so we started, I was a Ranger, Shane was a paladin, though he didn't much act like one, Red XIII was the Dungeon Master, of course, and the other two guys, who's father we'd borrowed the little kit from, were a warrior with double handed weaponry (that came in handy despite his being annoying) and a... presit... err yeah... our character sketches were... odd... one looked like a helmeted warrior, while Shanes was South Parks Cartmen Holding a little sword and Shield, I drew my character with weapons in hand akira-toryama Manga style and put a patch over his eye... ARRR...

And so we were off! My luck in stats was... god awful... i couldnt roll anything in the teens, but no matter, I still had a long bow and a little spear, it proved worthless, the longbow didnt, and later I found a longbow +1, which did 1-4 lightening damage! YAY!

Shane got a Fire sword, which he tested out on a squirrel which one of my misguided arrows had already done the job of injuring, he liked it and I'm not sure if he ate it afterwords, but my being a ranger I was not exactly happy >_<

The Dungeon Master.... was... quite kind actually... too kind in some aspects... but he was a rookie after alll, its not like we started fighting liches! though we did track over the tland of the undead, the map we drew was rediculouse, it had ONE town, two castles, a whole lotta dragon mountains, swamps, rivers, forest, a land of the undead and a lolly pop forest to boot!

Im glad we never quested over there! Just imagine the killer Gingerbrread men and Likorish Liches! AAAH!

anyhoo... I'd say that was down right FUN didley unn! I think i leveld up i had 2050exp in all so i was at least level 2, too bad i head to leave before we took ont he necromancer kiing, i did manage to nail a few goblins and skeletons though! all the while my arrows that missed were making quite the... iompression...

Once I fired and arrow and tripped, it went straight up, then a skeleton warrior did the same, our arrows colided and splintered up in the air, another time, the arrow bounced off of several cave walls and still managed to hurt and enemie with a critical 6! Orks were pretty tough and the enemy mages didnt get to cast any spells on us thanks to our dual-weaponed annoyance... anyway, all in-all id say that went well, aside from the guys dad walking in and asking us what we were doing! heh! We had to explain that "no we WERENT actually playing a video game for once we WERE playhing table top RPGs with HIS status sheets, HIS painted figurines and HIS papers, which we soon realized were ORIGINAL and not coppies @_@ eeerrr... He got the figurines to DEMI-GOD status too! EEEP!!! scarry scarry!

Anyhoo that all went well, I also got to see what a Cow run was...

...

...

God damn thats silly... But then again, Myth II had exploding deer, so i suppose Diablo II could have killer cows... >_>

AAAND to make this all that much more entertaining I have decided to INVENT my own Table Top RPG!!

You Ready for this?

What happens when you mix Sci FI with Feudal Japan and have it take place on a foreign planet that just happens to be man’s last hope for survival AND contains the most evil entity int he universe buried beneath its surface? You get Phantasy Star! And here’s my concept of how you can take any every-day AD&D Tabbletop Pen and Paper RPG and make it into a game totally unique in its style

Rules of engagement
The Rules are identical to that of an everyday Pen and Paper RPG, you make a character, make a map, set up some quests with the Dungeon Master (Principal) who sets up quests and rolls for all the monsters.

STATS
Just like in AD&D all you have to do is set up 14 for everything and distribute OR roll and hope to get lucky, The stats are:

Strenghte - Thats pretty self explanatory
Dexterity - So is that...
Constitution (HP) - In this game your constutution litterally IS your hit points
Intelligence - Needed to learn spells (androids have 0 on this stat and +14 can be distributed to any other stats they want
Wisdom - Magic power (once again this doesnt apply to ANDROIDS and they can distribute the 14 andywhere they want!
Charisma -Or Luck, allows you to hire henchmen (or Guards) and isnt that important

Heres an original one:
MAG - Now this isnt really a stat, its more of a thing which adds to stats, mags can be found as well as raised, traded, and bought. the DM (principal) desides what level each persons mag should be at the begining, the maximum level for a mag is 200. To raise a mag a potion must be used on it. ONe the potion is used the player can decide what stat they want increased by ONE level on it. Mags only affect 3 stats: Strength, Dexterity, and Wisdom. This means that Forces want high Wisdom mags so their Spells do more damage, Hunters want more power mags, and rangers want more dex. SO each time you use a potion your own stat goes up. Give up the mag and your stats go back to normal. SO if theDM is REAL REAL nice and says you find a mag with 200 mind, WOW your powerfull! Remember, its not bad to have a strong ranger or a hunter with alot of dex either.
REMEMBER mags are essential because they raise your stats without you leveling up. Treat your mag well and keep it well fed. (Oh and a mag with Wisdom stats does NOT help androids whatsoever)


The Characters To play as

The Dungeon Master
The DM in this game goes by the rank and title of PRINCIPAL. The principal’s duty is to roll for the monsters, hire the hunters, ranger, and foreces, and have them act as his pawns in a total war against the dark!

Hunters (warriors) -They use Sabers, Swords, Partisans, and Daggers.
HuMar- Human Male Hunter +3 Strenghte and +1 To wisdom automatically, roll for the rest of the stats.
HuNewearl - Newman Female Hutner, +1 Strenghte +3 wisdom along with other stats.
HuCast - Android, no mind so +4 Strenghte and the intelligent and wisdom stats add to the other stats,

Rangers -They use Handguns, Rifles, Shotguns, Sabers, and Machineguns.
RAmar- Human Male Ranger, +3 Strenghte +1 wisdom
RaMarl- Human Female Ranger +2 Wisdom, +2 Strenghte
RaCast- Ranger Android - +4 Strenghte+ All inteligent and wisdom stats are added to other stats.

Forces (mages) - Canes, Rods, Wands, Handguns and Sabers
FoNewmen- MaleGenetically altered Newmen Force +4Wisdom Automatically.
FoMar-Male Normal Force +1 Wisdom +3 Dex
FoNewearl- Female Genetically Altered Newmen Force +4 Wisdom automatially.

That’s all really! Genetically altered Newmens have pointey Ears, humans are just humans, and Casts are androids (remember, in turn for magic they can be like 2 X as strong)


Attributes of the game

Weapons:

Saber - Single Attack Short Range (all classes)
Handgun - SIngle Attack Short Range (Rangers and Forces)
Cane- Single attack, short range, adds to Wisdom and intelligence acoording to what the DM (principal) applies. (force only)
Sword- Medium Range, Single Attack (hunter only)
Rifle- Long Range, Single attack (ranger only)
Rod- Short Range, single attack, adds to wisom and inteligence. (force only)
Wand- Short Range, subtracts Strenghte and adds 2 X that number to wisdom (force)
Shotgun- Long Range Strikes up to 3 enemies at a time doing equally distributed damage(ranger only)
Dagger- Attacks twice with short range (hunter only)
MachineGun- Attacks Twice with long range (ranger only)
Partisan- Basic Spear (Hunter Only)

Note: Weapons Can have attirbutess added like +1 to +5 and can also be made into FIRE, ICE, LIGHTENING, and other elemental weapons. Just like how in AD&D you get a bow with +1-4 lightening damage, you can have a SHOCKrifle with +1-4 Lightening danmage [img]smile.gif[/img]

SPECIAL ITEMS
Special items can be used by anyone they cannot have stat atributed added to them because trhey automatically come with them. They are also useable by EVERY class

Maracas- Requires a dexterity of 30 +2-8 Lightening Damage attacks twice long range

Toy Hammer- Add the damage of 3 Rolls into one big attack, Requires 30 power

Psycho Wand - Requires Inteligence of 30, Eliminates the use of Charge Time all together!

Twin Chackram- Dagger for everyone (no stat req)

Spread Needle - Shotgun For everyone (20 dex is needed)

Yasminkov -Ranger only - Its a machine gun with twice the range and twice the number of rolls doen, 4 instead of 2, to do damage.

Sinow Beat Blades - Causes 4 times damage instead of 2 and at long range

Alive Aqhu Cadeceus - A wand that spreads feathers around and sheilds the team from enemy sight for 1 full turn. (has a charge time of 2 turns)

Ultimate Weaponry list:
The game is alot better without THESE but they do exist...
Heaven Punnisher - Ranger Only - Dex must be 50 - Does 8 roll damage equally to every enemy

SIckle of Soul devouring - Hunter Only - Expends half of ones HP and does 5 times the damage to all enemies - must have 50 Strenghte

The Sigh of a God - Spell book - Force only - eliminates Charge time and allows for spells to be cast 3 times in a row (With Something like grants thats alot of damage!)

I could put in a million or so weapons but im not going to...

Spells and Techniques:

For the non-android player, there are special options of dealing dmaage, but the DM err I mean the PRINCIPAL must decide upon when these spells are found and learned.

For ALL Human-Newmen players (not androids):

Foie - Fire Damage Rolls 1-4 + damage rolled on a dice of 6 Charge time: None
GiFoie - Fire Damage Rolls 2-8 + Damage roleld on a dice of 6 Charge time: 1 Turn
RaFoie - Fire Damage Rolls 3-12 + Damage rolled on a dice of 6 Charge time 2 turns
Barta - Ice Damage Rolls 1-4 + damage rolled on a dice of 6 Charge time: None
GiBarta - Ice Damage Rolls 2-8 + Damage roleld on a dice of 6 Charge time: 1 Turn
RaBarta - Ice Damage Rolls 3-12 + Damage rolled on a dice of 6 Charge time 2 turns
Note Barta can paralyce living things with ice but not machines
Zonde - Lightening Damage rolls 1-4 + Damage rolled Charge time None
GiZonde -Lightening dmaage Rolls 2-8 +Damage rolled CHarge time 1 turn
RaZonde -Lightening damage rolls 3-12 + damage rolled Charges for 2 turns
The Dungeon master can decide whether lightening paralyzes machines or not

ONLY for FORCES (FoMarl, FoMar, Fonewearl, FOnewmen)
Grants - Charge Time of 4 turns, does the combined damage of 6 rolls of a 6 sided die
(works on Bosses too!)
Megid - Charge time 5 turns, a 50/50 bet is placed on a die of 20, rolls above/below 10 cause instant death to one enemy (DOES NOT APPLY TO BOSSES)

Resta: Completley Heals all players (charge time 1)
Ryuker: Forms a gatweway back to town (charge time 2)
Anti: Anti-Palralasis, Anti-Freeze, Anti-Shock, Anti-Everystat change (Charge time 1)

Armor
As far as armor is concerned keep it at the same rules as before, rangers being able to use stealth, hutners having to sneak by, mages using types of invisibilty for evasion, while armor protection remains the same remember mags dont help add to armor so amror is completley untouched by these rules!

SOME armor that are unique to PSO rules
1: SENSE PLATE - Allows the bearer to see all traps ahead, the DM can’t lay down any suprise attacks without infoming them first...
2: CHU CHU FRAME - Its like having haste but its permanent
3: Electroshock Frame- It keeps androids from being Paralyzed by Electricity
4: State Maintence, Keeps the bearer from having stat damage done to them, including Dark FAlz Instant Death Technique roll.

THE MAP
Make it up yourself, the 4 environments for monsters are CAVES, MINES(for machines), FOREST, and RUINS (for the evil undead stuff)...

MONSTERS:
Forest Monsters
Rappy - Has 15 Hp, Gives 200 EXP, can “PECK” and do the damage rolled
Booma - Has 20 HP, Gives 250 EXp, can “swipe” and do the roleld damage
Wolf- Has 25 Hp, gives 300 Exp, can Bite and do rolled damage
Dragon - Boss, has 100 hp, gives 1500 Exp, can Breath Fire and do damage to all players, can also Dive and do phycisal damage to any 2 selected players, can also fly to avoid attack for 1 full turn in which only rangers and forces with handguns can hit him.
Cave Monsters
Lilly - Has 30 Hp, Can paralyze humans, gives 350 Exp, can also Bite,
Shark - Has 35 Hp, Gives 400 Exp, can swipe
Nano Dragon - has 40 HP Can Fly to evade Melee attack, can also take HP from the player and double it for itself acoording to damage done. gives 450 EXP,
Pan Arms - Has 45 HP Attacks Two players at once doing equal Damage, counts as two seperate monsters and each counts as 250 EXP so all in all 500EXP
Boss- THE WORM- DeRoLe Has 200 Hp, gives 3000 exp, spits acid to paralyze, does melee attack damage, can evade by diving for 2 turns, just enough time to heal up.
Mines Robots and Machines (Zonde Freezes here)
Gillchich - Has to be shot down, melee does not affect it, 50 hp, attacks single players with eletricity (if it hits an android the android is paralyzed) 550 exp a pop!
Dubwich - Melee Ground Robot, 55 Hp, Gives 600 exp
Sinow Beat- Fast Moving, Cloakable Enemy that has to be killed by melee attack. 60 Hp, gives 650 exp.
Garnaz- Rocket launching weapons platform, attacks all players with fire damage ranging from a set 1-6 per player and nothing more. 65 hp, biggun, gives 800 exp!
VOl Opt - The crazy machine - 300 hp gives 4500 exp, rolls lightening damage to all players along with single player damage roll. (so he hits one guy and does a 1-4 roll that hurts everyone)
Ruins- The equivalent of Hell...
Claw 70 Hp, gives 700 exp all it can do is bite and regroup . If regroup is done it takes 4 turns and the dice is rolled 5 times in a row to do damage to a single player!
Canadine 75 Hp, gives 750 Exp, hack and slash melee guy, killed by any means.
Unholy Knight Templar, Sorceror of Chaos- 80 Hp, can heal himself, cast Rafoie, and RaZonde on his popnents.
Unholy Knight Templar, Bringer of Chaos- 85 Hp, Steals Wisdom points! Thats right! He up and takes them away with the damage rolled! This means androids don’t have to worry about him that much and should attack while the others stay back.
BELRA- 90 Hp, Mother of all Melee units, it does 2 times rolled damage as well as electric 1-4 and fire 1-4 with each attack!
DARK FALIS- Lord of Destruction, hellspawn of Profound darkness, and unleasher of BAD
Fadk Falz Stage 1: First he comes out in a team of 20 spinners, the spinners are made to damage the players as much as possible before he is sumoned, spinners have 25 hp each an 20 of them is kind of hard!d
Stage 2: He comes and sends Melee attacks, his Hp is 1000, so he’s not that hard, but he can do some killer damage to your team seeing as every attack he makes deals damage to all players.
Starge 3, Exactly like stage 2, except his Hp is 1500!
Stage 4, Optional Final Stage, Only SUPER rares can be obtained by challanging his last form btu it can be left at stage 3 being beaten for a small team. Dark Falz has 3000 hp, he can, at the begining of the fight, automatically pick one player and have them instantly killed, then he floats aroudn and gets damaged, every 3 turns played he automatically picks another player to instnatly die, if he is beaten, then all players who died during the fight are revived and exp is granted. The Exp is a whopping 9000 for surviving all fights and the DM MUST award at least 1 ultimate weapon to the group. Once Falz is defeated the game starts over again witht he bosses being beaten in order.

if the first time, the team refuses to fight FALZ last form, they must get to him and strenghten so that they can fight the last form again, if the teeam should fail on the second run the game starts all over again!

Ok So how much EXP is needed to level?
About 2000 per level will do nicely, nearing level 5 it increases to 3000, level 10 its 4000.

Once you level, your Stats increase by about 3 each, if you are an android strenghte and dexterity go up 6 each, Remember you have no inteligence or wisdom to raise.

Alright then that’s all you need to know to play, the rest is up to you to make up really!

wow what a waste of my time! If you ever wanna play it Red, just say so heh... I know you won't though! that's coo!

And here's a picture of an RaMar and an Racast...umm... sitting there
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Old 03-10-2002, 09:10 AM   #2
Lavindathar
Harper
 

Join Date: March 21, 2001
Location: Lancs, England
Age: 39
Posts: 4,729
BUMP!!

Good post, people deserve to c it.
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Old 03-10-2002, 12:39 PM   #3
/)eathKiller
Dracolisk
 

Join Date: January 5, 2002
Location: Guantanamo Bay, Cuba
Age: 38
Posts: 6,043
Im suprised that Red XIII hasn't added to the story! I left room for the Dungeon master to go on and describe exactly what he was doing... heh... what goes on in the mind of a DM?

[ 03-10-2002: Message edited by: /)eathKiller ]

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Old 03-11-2002, 10:55 AM   #4
Redblueflare
Galvatron
 

Join Date: May 9, 2001
Location: The backwoods in Georgia *sigh*
Age: 39
Posts: 2,151
Boy that was a quick three hours. We started the quest with some town. (Yes that was the town's name, and no I didn't name it.) Some town was under attack by goblins, and a Paladin, Fighter, Cleric and Ranger party were asked for help. A the goblin cave, the party creates a plan to get in. Or should've.

Paladin: I'm not going in there!
Me: Are you kiding? You're a Paladin, you're supposed to be the first one in there!
Paladin: Alright I'm just going to charge in there.
Me: You're going to charge right past some goblins in plate mail, with 11 dexterity and expect to get by?
Paladin: Yup.
I decided to be nice and allow a dexterity check. I figured a roll of 18 would be sufficient. Paladin rolled a 19. The Ranger sneaks in with stealth, the cleric decides to wait outside, and the Fighter decides to try the Paladins luck. He also makes it in, but decides to go for a sneak attack. And misses. Well it was up to the Pally and Ranger to save his butt, and they do, but the brave idiot (who really is crazy in real life.) takes a little bit of damage. (I made sure of it.) [img]tongue.gif[/img]
After that quest was over, (and realizing goblins shouldn't have an AC of zero.) the party decides to head to the Land of the Undead. A somewhat friendly looking ghost shows up.
Paladin: I attack the ghost!
Me: You're going to attack him okay...
Paladin: I talk to the ghost with my sword drawn!
That's where we stopped cause Ian aka /)eathkiller had to come home. That was fun!

Oh and thanks for *another* sig Ian, and yes you have way to much time on your hands...


[ 03-11-2002: Message edited by: Redblueflare ]

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Old 03-12-2002, 07:31 PM   #5
/)eathKiller
Dracolisk
 

Join Date: January 5, 2002
Location: Guantanamo Bay, Cuba
Age: 38
Posts: 6,043
heh... I think i didn't do the flesh tones correctly... shes glowing like a bug zapper... oh well too late to fix that now...

I just realized that HERE your name's redBlueFlare and umm Im sorry about that, ill fix the sig for you ASAP

and while on the subject of sigs, take a look at this monstrocity


[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: /)eathKiller ]

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Old 03-14-2002, 06:04 AM   #6
Glorfindel
Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice
 

Join Date: January 9, 2002
Location: Mt. Gambier, Australia
Age: 36
Posts: 3,337
Lol this is a cool thread. [img]smile.gif[/img] If ya play again plz post in on it [img]smile.gif[/img]
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Old 03-14-2002, 10:11 AM   #7
/)eathKiller
Dracolisk
 

Join Date: January 5, 2002
Location: Guantanamo Bay, Cuba
Age: 38
Posts: 6,043
well we do plan on venturing back into the world of lolly pops and liches this weekend... this time im bringing cardboard cut-out figurines that i drew myself!
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Old 03-18-2002, 06:07 AM   #8
/)eathKiller
Dracolisk
 

Join Date: January 5, 2002
Location: Guantanamo Bay, Cuba
Age: 38
Posts: 6,043
Well we met again for the 2nd time in a row, just like last time, we were up against the GREAT Necromancer and his army of skeletons where we'd left off… out fire-sword weilding "fearless leader" decided to dissapear and go play some eleged games of video with the Dungeon master's brother -_- putting me in charge of the little crew… I, being a 6 star commander from the great wars of Tau'ceti (battle tech board game) knew… ABSOLUTLEY NOTHING of what to do! So I started getting creative!

Me: "Lets sneak in the back of the castle using… STEALTH.."

DM: umm ok roll for the evasion to get in…

*rolls like 18

DM: lucky…

Me: ok Red, lets have the other two follow suit…

Others"we want to go in the main entrance…"

DM"ok Death you're on your own…"

Me:" -_- ; Is the Necromancer present…?"

DM"you've snuk within a viewing distance of him"

Me"in that case I choose to shoot arrows at him!"

DM"you'll be seen but ok!"

*rolls a hit *

DM: Lucky…

for those who are more visually entertained… here's the story in a comic

For the readers… we basically all fought, though I was targeting the leader solo while the others were trying to take down some Ghasts and skeletons… I finished off the nekromancer after he stole 4 HP from me, and I only did it thanks to haste allowing me to shoot two arrows per turn, I shot one and got him down to like 2 HP then I rolled a two! The funniest thing that happened through was when one of the angry skeletons Rolled a 20!!! And then a 6!!! That was the most damage ive ever seen a weak little skeleton do… I had enough HP to handel the situation though, and the fighter fought… yeah… and the Preist was just invincible and kept healing us, lucky guy… but im glad he did haste!

After that we saw a tortch… we didn’t want to touch it, so we sent in the preists younger brother who was a fighter… he pulled the sucker and fell through a trap door… after having a good laugh me and the priest realized that the Necromancers army running the pallace we were in were all sort of grouping around our only exists… SO we jumped in too! I belive the phraise the priest used was
"LETS DO IT!"

Anyway, after splashing through some water (too bad I didn’t get to use my +1-4 lightening arrows in the water eheheh) we found some big beetles… they sucked.. and inot in an easy way… I acutally got paralyzed Suprisingly, our dual-weaponed fighter saved the day… 9_9 and then the priest did too… we met the ghost whom our knight shane had declared a peacefull threat (talked to him with his sword drawn) and he awarded us… the DM can tell you what we got but ill just say that I got enough to pay for a whole lotta' arrows… [img]tongue.gif[/img] and a doggie! Well ok it was a wolf, but it’s a good wold, I wanted to name him Deefenbaker, the DM chose the name snow…

I dnd't go to the pub with everyone else obviously… and so now… I guess we're just gonna get set for our new adventure… I can't wait for the warrior Shane to get back, he'll be level 1 and leaing a group of level 3s hehe…

Maybe next time the DM will get to play with his female magic-… person… err warlock? Err wtich? Err something like that… OH a MAGE yeah that’s the word!


Im wondering if any of my stats go up due to my leveling twice because my strenghte hasn’t gone anywhere nor has my dexterity… infact the only thing that’s gone up is my constitution.. I still have the same armor class… I have about 1900 gold saved up, and the DM offered me at the store a PLATE MAIL for 1800… the preist nearly bought it, but I sat there cold faced even as the fighter agreed to buy it.. then I spoke up:


"Excuse me but that would take away all of my assets AND take away my ability to use stealth…"

DM: "very smart Ranger…"
My throwing penalties went down too and I gianed a proficiency in Haliberts… though I already have a spear that attacks twice… leaving me with 3 weapons (yes I sold my bow for like 20 gold, it was just a stick with a string tied to it anyway… My +1 Longbow with 1-4 lightening damage is here to stay of course and the DM is really working now! He even busted out some Baldor's gate monsters hehe…

If I ever get to be DM ill attack the crew with EL RAPPIES, weak birds that have 1495 HP and can only PECK you at close range…Did I mention they were fat, yellow, and couldn’t fly?

Yeah well anyway, I absolutley cannot wait to see what quest the DM has set up for us next week, the way I see it one of 3 things could happen: MY friends in the tavern will get in a bar fight and I'll somehow be forced to join in though Im on the outskirts of town hanging with some squirrels… even better: I could meet a young boy out there who needs some people saved like his parents or something… I dunnow… OR we could spend the night at an inn and then suddenly have theives show up and attack us in the night!

I guess more could happen then that but I dunnow... time doesnt really seem to pass in this world though so maybe we wont need to stay in an inn, though it did get dark really fast...

Hmmm maybe the DM can give us a little hint as to what fortune... err... fate will befall us next week?


if he doesn't i'll sick my wolf on him
_____________

Looks like the Ranger got stood up again...
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Old 03-18-2002, 06:16 AM   #9
TheThing
Banned User
 

Join Date: March 17, 2002
Location: shadow
Posts: 246
Quote:
If I ever get to be DM ill attack the crew with EL RAPPIES, weak birds that have 1495 HP and can only PECK you at close range…Did I mention they were fat, yellow, and couldn’t fly?
in that case, you can use a chocabo instead.

anyway, it sounds really fun, thanks for posting [img]smile.gif[/img]
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Old 03-18-2002, 07:13 AM   #10
/)eathKiller
Dracolisk
 

Join Date: January 5, 2002
Location: Guantanamo Bay, Cuba
Age: 38
Posts: 6,043
yeah except you can't RIDE rappies, and after just one hit the whole group of em scatters like chickens... but not like Chickens... err more like tubby ostritcches with short legs...
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