either you're with us or with the terrorists....

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Epona: The Taliban will not be bombed Bin Laden will not be bombed WHY? Because they will be hiding in bunkers paid for by the US! The Taliban was supported by the US to get Russia out of Afghanistan. They were armed by the US, and trained by the US. Bin Laden was a CIA agent for crying out loud! The US sets these people up, but it is not they who will come off worst in a bombing raid. Afghanistan is in crisis, people are starving to death - most of the population hate the Taliban, yet they will be the ones dying if the nation is bombed. More innocents will die - is that the way we want the world to be? The ordinary Afghani people can do nothing to fight the Taliban, or defend themselves against US retaliation - they are weak and tired. The west should give these people food and support to fight back against the hated Taliban - not bomb them out of existence. Do we want more innocent people buried in rubble?

Epona I agree with your ideas about not bombing Afgahnistan, but I believe your facts are in error. The US supported the Mujahadeen against the Soviet Union. The Taliban arose from the mountains after the Russians had left and displaced the Mujahadeen.

Also Bin Laden is a millionaire raised vehemently anti American by his father. Where did you hear that Bin Laden was a CIA agent? What motive would he have had for that?



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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[Yorick]

Rikard, Wahabi Sunni Islam is indeed intolerant of other faiths. Bin Laden shares the puritanical sects extremist views. Indeed, to most Islams, Christians insistance that Christ and God are one and the same is an extreme offense. They also do not believe that Christ (their greatest prophet, greater even than Muhammad) was crucified, and such an idea is abhorrent.

However it goes without saying that most Islamics are not violently seeking to stamp out believers in these ideas. The Taliban and Bin Laden and his ilk are a minority.


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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[This message has been edited by Yorick (edited 09-23-2001).]

[J.J.]

Correct once again, oh Bard. Laden was not a CIA agent - they merely trained, armed, and equipped him in his guerrilla war against the soviet invasion of afghanistan to prop up the secular communist government in kabul. Like all the other places in the world the US people's tax dollars were wasted in the fight against communism and totalitarian regimes, they used the 'enemy of my enemy' idea to pick who to support.
As far as those who say we should not bomb them or attack them, I can only shake my head in sadness. War was declared by the killing of innocent men women and children on american soil - we don't really care if you think we should not go after the murdering rabid dogs who did it. What do you think should be done about all the innocent people from YOUR country killed in the towers or on the planes, all you people who say don't do anything? 80 countries lost citizens, including yours. I find it slightly suprising and disheartening you advocate the 'talk and reason them to death' route, based on the past 25 years of failure it has produced, led us to this point in global history. With us or with the terrorists? you betcher *ss, buddy, George W. speaks for over 200 million of us, and we will remember who did and did not.

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Unstinting Gaurdian of Children
Defender of Those Unable To

To Err is Human To Forgive Divine, However Neither is U.S. Marine Corps Policy. Nuke'm til the damn camels glow.

[John D Harris]

Right on JJ! What realy chaps my sphinxster is after having learned a lesson about proping up an unpopular gov't in south central asia, from Iran. We help them (Afghanistan)win the war then let them decide for themselves the gov't they're going to have. I'd bet the dollars to donuts that if we had set-up a gov't in Afghanistan the same people would be complaining about that!

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"the memories of a man in his old age,
are deeds of a man in his prime"

[tracey]

woah there, proud beauties! there seems to be an awful lot of disgust for those of us who see a humanitarian disater looming. i for one, would never, ever, lend my support to any action that sees thousands or even one death or maiming occur for a simple act of revenge. there is no answer to terrorism. the best any of us can hope for is that those who are guilty of murdering the unfortunate people in the states will be found and tried in a court of law. anything else that happens is also murder.

several of you may disagree with this viewpoint - possibly understandably as your blood is pounding and the need to fight back and not feel powerless is overwhelming, however, do you really care so little for human life that you would sanction the governments of the world to destroy the lives of innocents?

in london a couple of years' ago, we had a huge bomb explode in the square mile - financial quater, planted by the ira (again!) if england had chosen to react by sending tanks and bombs into northern ireland, can you imagine what the reaction of the rest of the world would have been - yet, there are many in northern ireland who shelter and finance the ira on a regular basis. what do we do about the situation? negotiation and and the continued attempts at peace talks. this may sound like very little when ira terrorists have killed thousands over the years', however, there is no real alternative unless we were happy to go in all guns blazing and kill hundrends of people who had nothing whatever to do with it. they just happen to live there. rather like the afgans who just happen to live in afganistan.

[Haladar]

revenge is wrong... but, us and all the other allies that are supporting the US aren't in it for revenge. We're here to try and prevent these kind of artrocities occuring in the future, and if all the allies stand together and come down hard on bin Laden, even if he didnt do it, it might deter terrorists in the future if they know whats gonna get them.

[250]

Originally posted by Haladar: revenge is wrong... but, us and all the other allies that are supporting the US aren't in it for revenge. We're here to try and prevent these kind of artrocities occuring in the future, and if all the allies stand together and come down hard on bin Laden, even if he didnt do it, it might deter terrorists in the future if they know whats gonna get them.

they are gonna go to heaven with 100 virgins

if you think death can stop a terroist, then you are wrong

I still say: crastration... that way, they will sure have no desire to keep the fight

[tracey]

WHAT?

'even if he didn't do it'? am i dreaming this? there is absolutely no justification in waging war to make a point. it's a bit like smacking a child and for some misdemeanor they might engage in tomorrow.

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by tracey: WHAT? 'even if he didn't do it'? am i dreaming this? there is absolutely no justification in waging war to make a point. it's a bit like smacking a child and for some misdemeanor they might engage in tomorrow.

We ARE NOT DEALING WITH CHILDREN, they are adults that wantonly atacked civilains and killed men, women, and children!!!!! It is not revenge or retalation it it punishment. Bin Ladin and his orginization HAVE DONE enough terrorist acts in the past to justify striking him without taking in to account the acts of 11 September, 2001.



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"the memories of a man in his old age,
are deeds of a man in his prime"

[tracey]

right. punishment. not an attempt to bring the wrongdoers to justice? just a general lashing/smacking situation. okay. just so long as we all know where we stand.

hey, i know. why don't we have pre-emptive smacks - just in case something bad happens.