The RIAA sees the face of evil, and it's a 12-year-old girl...

[andrewas]

Does anyone have any data on how much of the price rise is due to piracy and how much is caused by sheer greed? I looked a while ago, but most of what I found was either RIAA propoganda or flat out denial of the problem.

[Zero Alpha]

So far the entire against side assumes that had the pirates not downloaded a song, they would have bought it. were this true i would be a definate advocate of buying cd's instead of downloading. thing is, most of these people would not have bought the CD anyway. so what are you complaining about, there is no money lost. you also fail to account for those people who have no money. how are they going to get music at todays high prices? they either wont, or they'll pirate it. simple.

[harleyquinn]

Sorry, but while I agree with you that CDs need to come down in price, the fact that they cost too much does not justify theft.
I think cars cost too much, you need $10,000 just to get a cheap one. So does that mean I can just go steal one off the lot, because hey, it's the car companies fault for charging so much? Nope! Same goes for music.
You're stealing if you download music you didn't pay for. If it's music that an artist posts for you to get for free (which some do) than that's one thing, but otherwise, it's stealing. The artist did not tell you that you could have that music, so you are not "helping their art". While there are some artist that do make lots of cash, there are others that break even if they make anything. For example, did you know that because of signing a bad contract, the GooGoo Dolls were losing money until recently? That's because many new artists are required to pay for their own touring and promotional expenses, so that's why, even though they were selling records like crazy, they themselves were seeing almost no money. So anyone that was downloading their songs were actually hurting them by denying them even more money that is rightfully theres.

Sorry people, life's not fair, things cost more than sometimes they should (gas comes to mind). Want to stick it to the music industry? The answer's not in downloading music, that's stealing, and the law's on their side. The answer is to stop buying cds, and write a letter to the companies telling them that you will not be buying any more music until the prices come down. Then get your friends and family to do the same. If they can't sell CDs, the prices will fall to entice people to buy more, simple economics.

[The Hierophant]

Originally posted by Chewbacca: They have merely helped unemploy literally tens of thousands of people (INCLUDING ME!) making less than 40k a year. The retail workers and record label street reps are the mains ones to get hurt, not the executives or artists. So all I have to say to music theives and priates is I believe in karma so if you know what you are doing is wrong, I believe you will indeed get yours one day. edited out offensive middle finger smiley.

boo hoo. Go get a different job. The sooner the music 'industry' decays and musicians are forced to back to singing for their supper (myself included) instead of living 'the rocktar lifestyle' the better. For the most part, the 'industry' serves to employ vampiric parasites who have nothing to do with musicianship at all. Hangers-on like retailers, promoters, marchandisers, and advertisers should never have been given the chance to form their racket the way they have done over the past 50 odd years in the first place. The sooner they die out the better.

[Felix The Assassin]

Originally posted by Harkoliar: the way they are doing is very ridiculous. they obviously took the wrong path (like Z said) in defending thier music industry. i dont mind they take precaution in defending thier music but a 12 year old girl or children for that matter have no concept of rules and such in the industry. children are children and they make mistakes or do mistakes without knowing they are doing it in the first place.

How do you propose they settle this?
They tracked her down by her handle. The article even stated the mother paid for the profile. Therefore, she also knew what was going on!

Then this falls back to a thing called parenthood! My 12 yr old daughter has internet access, but she is supervised during her sessions.

Felix

[Sir Kenyth]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: quote: Originally posted by Chewbacca: They have merely helped unemploy literally tens of thousands of people (INCLUDING ME!) making less than 40k a year. The retail workers and record label street reps are the mains ones to get hurt, not the executives or artists. So all I have to say to music theives and priates is I believe in karma so if you know what you are doing is wrong, I believe you will indeed get yours one day. edited out offensive middle finger smiley.

boo hoo. Go get a different job. The sooner the music 'industry' decays and musicians are forced to back to singing for their supper (myself included) instead of living 'the rocktar lifestyle' the better. For the most part, the 'industry' serves to employ vampiric parasites who have nothing to do with musicianship at all. Hangers-on like retailers, promoters, marchandisers, and advertisers should never have been given the chance to form their racket the way they have done over the past 50 odd years in the first place. The sooner they die out the better. [/QUOTE]Heh, heh! [img]graemlins/biglaugh.gif[/img]

Bravo!


By the way, this "racket" isn't just in the music business. It's what drives our capitalistic economy. Pass the cost down, and pass the profits up. To make money by doing nothing but investing, lending, controlling, and directing is the American dream. Unfortunately, someone has to produce an actual product to manipulate and receive adequate compensation for doing it. Our production center is starting to hurt because those with the dollars are holding back. They aren't willing to pay the price. They can afford to try to wait it out until profits look better. They won't deplete their own monies for no decent profit. This is how recessions and depressions start. The cycle of money stops flowing because investors aren't confident in spending. Jobs are lost as prices rise and the job market falls apart. It's also why inflation exists. It has to. It counter-balances high interest rates by devaluing the loan principle amount. It also helps to continue the illusion that you're constantly getting "raises" at your job. Each measure produces a counter measure and a counter counter measure, it's a constant silent complex battle between everyone to get "more". welcome to the delicate and utterly confusing world of economics. The irony is, in the end, protecting yourself by saving and not spending causes the demise of the economic balance. By spending and not saving too much, you can destroy yourself.

[Chewbacca]

Originally posted by The Hierophant: quote: Originally posted by Chewbacca: They have merely helped unemploy literally tens of thousands of people (INCLUDING ME!) making less than 40k a year. The retail workers and record label street reps are the mains ones to get hurt, not the executives or artists. So all I have to say to music theives and priates is I believe in karma so if you know what you are doing is wrong, I believe you will indeed get yours one day. edited out offensive middle finger smiley.

boo hoo. Go get a different job. The sooner the music 'industry' decays and musicians are forced to back to singing for their supper (myself included) instead of living 'the rocktar lifestyle' the better. For the most part, the 'industry' serves to employ vampiric parasites who have nothing to do with musicianship at all. Hangers-on like retailers, promoters, marchandisers, and advertisers should never have been given the chance to form their racket the way they have done over the past 50 odd years in the first place. The sooner they die out the better. [/QUOTE]Oooh Mr. high and mighty "go find another job boo hoo" I guess the concept of doing what you love is lost on you becasue the industry is full of vampires. Stuff it far and deep.

[Calaethis Dragonsbane]

I'm wondering something. Does the RIAA have any juristiction OUTSIDE the USA? I'm not going to state my views on this thing; but I'm just curious to know if they do have the right to arrest non-US citizens in other countries.

[Luvian]

Originally posted by Calaethis Dragonsbane: I'm wondering something. Does the RIAA have any juristiction OUTSIDE the USA? I'm not going to state my views on this thing; but I'm just curious to know if they do have the right to arrest non-US citizens in other countries.

Probably not, but I guess they could arrest you if you visit the USA.

[ 09-10-2003, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: Luvian ]

[Faceman]

Now people go easy on Chewbacca. It's not his fault the RIAA is sueing a 12-year old
He lost his job and that is bad enough. Why his store went down I can't say. But I can't blame him for being mad at people who get for free what he used to sell and then sticking it to him.

+ The often heard argument of car theft is not valid because you aren't actually "stealing" something concrete (which would involve the victim to lose it) but copying and idea. More like stealing the car's plans and building it on your own (with all the resources provided for free however [img]smile.gif[/img] ).
+ copyright laws the way they are used nowadays are flawed. By purchasing a CD you are actually purchasing the right to listen to a song whenever you want to. But what if a song is stuck in your head and you haven't purchased it? (a bit extreme I know). What about taping a song from the radio or taping a movie on TV.
I like to watch US sitcoms and other TV shows and for that purpose download them from P2P. I get them one year earlier than they air here (if they do) and in original language. Is this illegal? I'm not sure. There are season DVDs out for purchasing but why am I any different from the people who tape every episode on their VCR? Or why different from the people that borrow that tapes and copy them for themselves?
The P2P issue only demonstrates the problems copyright law always had but which never showed. If you only lend the CD to a friend to let him tape it it is overlooked but once everyone becomes everyone's friend over the web it becomes a problem. If someone hosts a song he owns (owns the CD) on his webpage to play it to visitors (streaming of course) it's much like if a friend plays me a CD when I visit him. However here it is illegal because the song lands on my hard-drive (which is just my extended brain in that case [img]smile.gif[/img] )
and so on...

There is need of a re-evaluation of copyright laws and a lot of clearing up to do (and I do NOT necessarily mean that everything should be free immediately; this has to be found out in a proper judical, philosophical and sociological discussion and not only founded on one sides opinion).