IWD party - thoughts

Nutman · 12-28-2003, 03:05 PM

Gidday, was wondering what you think of this party:

Dwarf Fighter
Human Paladin
Elven Cleric
Halfling (human?) Fighter/Thief
Human Bard
Elven Mage (Conjurer?)

I wouldn’t mind including a ranger in the party somehow – maybe start my cleric off as a ranger and dual class early on?

With my fighter/thief I thought its best to start him off as a multi-class (so I have thief abilities from the beginning) rather than getting the fighter/thief combo thru dual classing – what do you think?

I didn’t play a bard in BG1 so thought it might be fun to try one with IWD

I am note sure whether to go for a straight mage or specialise as a conjurer (as I have seen recommended) – even though you specialise in a certain school of magic do you still learn spells from the other schools (apart from the opposition school)??

Thanks for any suggestions
Cheers
Nutman

Lymond · 12-29-2003, 05:13 PM

It looks like a pretty well balanced party to me. I ran one very similar with the cleric multi classed as a cleric ranger from the start. Her natural enemy was skeletons, and that made her very dangerous throughout the game.

I don't think much of Paladins, but I suspect most people do. I would prefer a dual class fighter/mage. That was by far my most powerful character the last time around, so I'm biased.

Specializing is the way to go for the extra spell. The opposing school is the only type you can't use.

With so many fighters in your party, having a bard is going to be fantastic for you. If you have Heart of Winter installed, they're really powerful.

Good Luck with it!

Lymond

Nutman · 12-29-2003, 09:30 PM

Hi Lymond, thanks for your response. I might look into making the cleric/ranger a multi-class as you suggested - does this give me enough healing power?

I don't have HoW yet, but will still go with a bard.

By the way, did you play IWD with the open GL option going - does it make much difference

cheers
Nutman

Dundee Slaytern · 12-30-2003, 04:01 AM

What difficulty level are you playing on? At lower levels, the sloooow XP progression for a multiclass can be a major handicap.

Core Difficulty is just about the bare minimum for multiclass tolerance. Might want to consider a dualclassed Ranger->Cleric instead.

Nutman · 12-30-2003, 05:04 PM

Gidday,

I am playing on normal difficulty (default), if I dual class I won't have those healing spells at the beggining of the game?

cheers
Nutman

Dundee Slaytern · 12-31-2003, 01:05 PM

Well... it will not take long to level up your Ranger (or Fighter, if you want Grandmastery) to level 3 (and henceforth, dual), and quite frankly, it is playable without Healing spells in the beginning, although your resting periods will start to look like party-induced comas.

NobleNick · 01-12-2004, 11:14 AM

Gidday, was wondering what you think of this party:

Dwarf Fighter
Human Paladin
Elven Cleric
Halfling (human?) Fighter/Thief
Human Bard
Elven Mage (Conjurer?)

I wouldn’t mind including a ranger in the party somehow – maybe start my cleric off as a ranger and dual class early on?

Nutman, First off, I agree with what Lymond says, as modified by Dundee and my comments. The Pally is good, really comes into his own late in the basic game, if you know what *ONE* weapon to get for him.

With my fighter/thief I thought its best to start him off as a multi-class (so I have thief abilities from the beginning) rather than getting the fighter/thief combo thru dual classing – what do you think?
Working the Thief in has always been a toughie for me, since his skills are so important, yet you give up so much to have them. I agree that MC is typically not the way to go, since progression is so slow. The DC option has it's drawbacks especially in this case, since it is tough to go without a Thief for most of the game; but if you have "Knock" and the Bard's pickpocket skills available, you should be able to muddle through.

I didn’t play a bard in BG1 so thought it might be fun to try one with IWD
You have HoW, right? Then the Bard is an EXCELLENT addition to your party!

I am note sure whether to go for a straight mage or specialise as a conjurer (as I have seen recommended) – even though you specialise in a certain school of magic do you still learn spells from the other schools (apart from the opposition school)??
Yes, but since the Conjuror's opposition school includes (IIRC) Evocation (which some hold as the most important school), Conjuring is probably the worse school to specialize in. The best specialist (IMHO) is Illusionist, since the Illusionist's repetoire includes the 3 most useful schools (listed in my descending order of importance): Conjuring; Evocation; and Illusion. The Mage benefits by Dual Classing (DC) from Fighter, and the Bard can carry the burden of being the main magic user until the Fighter/Mage DCs.

Your Cleric would also profit by DCing from Fighter. If you want to squeeze Ranger skills into the party, You could DC your Cleric to Ranger; and, to keep Cleric skills active in the party, DC your Fighter to Cleric. If you do HoW, and exercise patience, you can DC at about Fighter 9 and Cleric 12, while still in the basic IWD game, and have very powerful characters to use in HoW/TotLM. The two clerics, Pally and Bard (when singing "War Chant") represent a lot of healing/Cleric-power, but you will not be sorry you have it when you hit HoW/TotLM.

Of course, all DC characters are Human. You need to make sure at least one character in your party has infravision, which trait humans do not possess.

So, based on what you say you want, and assuming you will take this party into HoW/TotLM after visiting LDD but before finishing IWD, I would recommend:

DC Fighter9/Cleric
Paladin (must be human)
DC Cleric12/Ranger
DC Fighter9/Thief
Dwarven or Gnome Bard
DC Fighter9/Illusionist

This party gives you all the skills you were hankering for; and, with everyone in the party skilled in melee, your party will kick ogre-butt when the Bard starts singing "War Chant." No elves in the party; but this is actually an advantage, since you can't resurrect those guys anyway. (And you WILL need to resurrect folks in HoW/TotLM, unless you're a much better player than me.)

Hope this helped....

--------------------
What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!

[ 01-12-2004, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: NobleNick ]

Yanez · 01-12-2004, 01:26 PM

NobleNick

I don't want to be disrespectful, but I want to add just one small nitpick. AFAIK dwarves and gnomes cannot become bards (unless TotLM changed this).Only humans and half-elves are allowed to be bards. So, if you want infravision, the half-elven bard is the only way to go. Resurrection shouldn't be the problem, since the singing bard must be kept out of the fray, and we all know that bard's best asset are their battle songs.

Edit: typos

[ 01-12-2004, 01:27 PM: Message edited by: Yanez ]

pritchke · 01-12-2004, 01:37 PM

I would change NobleNick's party to this:

DC Fighter9/Cleric
Paladin (must be human)
Druid
DC Fighter9/Thief
Bard Humam or half/elf
DC Fighter9/Illusionist

While Ranger/Clerics are great, you will be lacking some offensive spells. The Druid can be used as a punching bag when it can turn to earth/water elemental, healer, or offensive spell caster depending on what you require. Any party with both a Druid and a bard is potent.

[ 01-12-2004, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

ZFR · 01-12-2004, 01:37 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong but AFAIK:

Elves have no problems with resurrection. they cannot be "raise-dead"ed
though.
Half-elves on the other hand can be both resurrected and raisedeaded

12-29-2003, 05:13 PM	#2
Lymond Manshoon Join Date: February 6, 2003 Location: Boston, MA Age: 55 Posts: 175	It looks like a pretty well balanced party to me. I ran one very similar with the cleric multi classed as a cleric ranger from the start. Her natural enemy was skeletons, and that made her very dangerous throughout the game. I don't think much of Paladins, but I suspect most people do. I would prefer a dual class fighter/mage. That was by far my most powerful character the last time around, so I'm biased. Specializing is the way to go for the extra spell. The opposing school is the only type you can't use. With so many fighters in your party, having a bard is going to be fantastic for you. If you have Heart of Winter installed, they're really powerful. Good Luck with it! Lymond __________________ Hard work pays off in the long run. Laziness pays off right now.

01-12-2004, 01:37 PM	#10
ZFR Legion Symbol Join Date: February 14, 2002 Location: Ireland Age: 39 Posts: 7,367	Correct me if I'm wrong but AFAIK: Elves have no problems with resurrection. they cannot be "raise-dead"ed though. Half-elves on the other hand can be both resurrected and raisedeaded __________________ ZFR

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12-28-2003, 03:05 PM	#1
Nutman Dungeon Master Join Date: July 18, 2002 Location: New Zealand Age: 52 Posts: 90	Gidday, was wondering what you think of this party: Dwarf Fighter Human Paladin Elven Cleric Halfling (human?) Fighter/Thief Human Bard Elven Mage (Conjurer?) I wouldn’t mind including a ranger in the party somehow – maybe start my cleric off as a ranger and dual class early on? With my fighter/thief I thought its best to start him off as a multi-class (so I have thief abilities from the beginning) rather than getting the fighter/thief combo thru dual classing – what do you think? I didn’t play a bard in BG1 so thought it might be fun to try one with IWD I am note sure whether to go for a straight mage or specialise as a conjurer (as I have seen recommended) – even though you specialise in a certain school of magic do you still learn spells from the other schools (apart from the opposition school)?? Thanks for any suggestions Cheers Nutman

12-29-2003, 09:30 PM	#3
Nutman Dungeon Master Join Date: July 18, 2002 Location: New Zealand Age: 52 Posts: 90	Hi Lymond, thanks for your response. I might look into making the cleric/ranger a multi-class as you suggested - does this give me enough healing power? I don't have HoW yet, but will still go with a bard. By the way, did you play IWD with the open GL option going - does it make much difference cheers Nutman

12-30-2003, 04:01 AM	#4
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 41 Posts: 11,063	What difficulty level are you playing on? At lower levels, the sloooow XP progression for a multiclass can be a major handicap. Core Difficulty is just about the bare minimum for multiclass tolerance. Might want to consider a dualclassed Ranger->Cleric instead.

12-30-2003, 05:04 PM	#5
Nutman Dungeon Master Join Date: July 18, 2002 Location: New Zealand Age: 52 Posts: 90	Gidday, I am playing on normal difficulty (default), if I dual class I won't have those healing spells at the beggining of the game? cheers Nutman

12-31-2003, 01:05 PM	#6
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 41 Posts: 11,063	Well... it will not take long to level up your Ranger (or Fighter, if you want Grandmastery) to level 3 (and henceforth, dual), and quite frankly, it is playable without Healing spells in the beginning, although your resting periods will start to look like party-induced comas.

01-12-2004, 11:14 AM	#7
NobleNick Quintesson Join Date: February 5, 2002 Location: Huntsville, AL, USA Age: 63 Posts: 1,045	Gidday, was wondering what you think of this party: Dwarf Fighter Human Paladin Elven Cleric Halfling (human?) Fighter/Thief Human Bard Elven Mage (Conjurer?) I wouldn’t mind including a ranger in the party somehow – maybe start my cleric off as a ranger and dual class early on? Nutman, First off, I agree with what Lymond says, as modified by Dundee and my comments. The Pally is good, really comes into his own late in the basic game, if you know what ONE weapon to get for him. With my fighter/thief I thought its best to start him off as a multi-class (so I have thief abilities from the beginning) rather than getting the fighter/thief combo thru dual classing – what do you think? Working the Thief in has always been a toughie for me, since his skills are so important, yet you give up so much to have them. I agree that MC is typically not the way to go, since progression is so slow. The DC option has it's drawbacks especially in this case, since it is tough to go without a Thief for most of the game; but if you have "Knock" and the Bard's pickpocket skills available, you should be able to muddle through. I didn’t play a bard in BG1 so thought it might be fun to try one with IWD You have HoW, right? Then the Bard is an EXCELLENT addition to your party! I am note sure whether to go for a straight mage or specialise as a conjurer (as I have seen recommended) – even though you specialise in a certain school of magic do you still learn spells from the other schools (apart from the opposition school)?? Yes, but since the Conjuror's opposition school includes (IIRC) Evocation (which some hold as the most important school), Conjuring is probably the worse school to specialize in. The best specialist (IMHO) is Illusionist, since the Illusionist's repetoire includes the 3 most useful schools (listed in my descending order of importance): Conjuring; Evocation; and Illusion. The Mage benefits by Dual Classing (DC) from Fighter, and the Bard can carry the burden of being the main magic user until the Fighter/Mage DCs. Your Cleric would also profit by DCing from Fighter. If you want to squeeze Ranger skills into the party, You could DC your Cleric to Ranger; and, to keep Cleric skills active in the party, DC your Fighter to Cleric. If you do HoW, and exercise patience, you can DC at about Fighter 9 and Cleric 12, while still in the basic IWD game, and have very powerful characters to use in HoW/TotLM. The two clerics, Pally and Bard (when singing "War Chant") represent a lot of healing/Cleric-power, but you will not be sorry you have it when you hit HoW/TotLM. Of course, all DC characters are Human. You need to make sure at least one character in your party has infravision, which trait humans do not possess. So, based on what you say you want, and assuming you will take this party into HoW/TotLM after visiting LDD but before finishing IWD, I would recommend: DC Fighter9/Cleric Paladin (must be human) DC Cleric12/Ranger DC Fighter9/Thief Dwarven or Gnome Bard DC Fighter9/Illusionist This party gives you all the skills you were hankering for; and, with everyone in the party skilled in melee, your party will kick ogre-butt when the Bard starts singing "War Chant." No elves in the party; but this is actually an advantage, since you can't resurrect those guys anyway. (And you WILL need to resurrect folks in HoW/TotLM, unless you're a much better player than me.) Hope this helped.... -------------------- What's a party, without a song? Bards ROCK! Party On!! [ 01-12-2004, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: NobleNick ]

01-12-2004, 01:26 PM	#8
Yanez Manshoon Join Date: September 13, 2002 Location: Sunny side of the Alps, a.k.a. Slovenia Age: 47 Posts: 194	NobleNick I don't want to be disrespectful, but I want to add just one small nitpick. AFAIK dwarves and gnomes cannot become bards (unless TotLM changed this).Only humans and half-elves are allowed to be bards. So, if you want infravision, the half-elven bard is the only way to go. Resurrection shouldn't be the problem, since the singing bard must be kept out of the fray, and we all know that bard's best asset are their battle songs. Edit: typos [ 01-12-2004, 01:27 PM: Message edited by: Yanez ]

01-12-2004, 01:37 PM	#9
pritchke Bastet - Egyptian Cat Goddess Join Date: September 5, 2001 Location: Calgary, AB Age: 49 Posts: 3,491	I would change NobleNick's party to this: DC Fighter9/Cleric Paladin (must be human) Druid DC Fighter9/Thief Bard Humam or half/elf DC Fighter9/Illusionist While Ranger/Clerics are great, you will be lacking some offensive spells. The Druid can be used as a punching bag when it can turn to earth/water elemental, healer, or offensive spell caster depending on what you require. Any party with both a Druid and a bard is potent. [ 01-12-2004, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: pritchke ]

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