05-12-2002, 10:14 AM | #71 | |
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we demand proof and that is how it should be. |
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05-12-2002, 10:37 AM | #72 | |
20th Level Warrior
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But love the pic of Abaddon the Despoiler, did you just crop it from a pic of him and resize it? |
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05-12-2002, 11:01 AM | #73 | |||||||||
Very Mad Bird
Join Date: January 7, 2001
Location: Breukelen (over the river from New Amsterdam)
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It takes more courage to wrestle with and master primal urges, than to be enslaved by them. With a moral code, I am a slave to nothing. Everything I do is by will and choice alone, unless it is a moment of weakness where instinct can take over. Strong morals equal self control. Will power. When in control of yourslef you can do anything. Battlerage in a conflict situation results in flawed weaker response. Full mental faculties result in faster response. Your line of thinking results in road rage murders, child abuse, maiming. war. Why supress the urge to molest a young boy Dramnek? They are only being honest about their urges are they not? You fool. Moral codes protect that young boy. The very thing you are condemning you would allow. [/QUOTE] Quote:
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Your unfactual opinion, and presumtive generalised declaration is insubstancial, incorrect and quite simply.... wrong. Quote:
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Mind your own business. |
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05-12-2002, 11:07 AM | #74 | |
Very Mad Bird
Join Date: January 7, 2001
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we demand proof and that is how it should be.[/QUOTE]Do you go and see the flight specks of a plane before you step on board? Do you test the airbag to see if it holds up in a crash? Do you go and find the inspection chart for a lift? Or do you have faith that the manufacturers and service personelle are speaking truth? You put your life in the hands of others all time. The faith occurs without much effort at all. |
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05-12-2002, 11:16 AM | #75 | |||
Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice
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I think that sort of supports the moral argument Yorick was giving to you, without them it wouldn't be wrong to kill cats would it. Quote:
And also, there are other social animals who have sex without pleasure, only us dolphins and I think maybe one or two other life forms have sex for pleasure, what's so differetn about us that means we need pleasure?? If I was a christian I would most likely say God, but since I'm not I don't know exactly why... maybe we have less of a sense of duty to nature than some animals.
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Resident cantankerous sorcerer of the Clan HADB<br />and Sorcerous Nuttella salesman of the O.R.T<br /> <br /><br />Say NO to the Trouser Tyranny! Can I drill you about this? |
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05-12-2002, 03:28 PM | #76 | |||
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Some people believe that Elvis still lives, doesn’t mean he does. Some people believe in ghosts, doesn’t mean they do exist. You cannot Prove that we can derive “ought” from an “is”. Arguments are meant to be based upon logic and evidence, not faith. Quote:
The first thing to realise is that there is no grand plan. What there is and what we have has evolved to Dominance because it best suited the circumstances for survival. Sexual reproduction allows greater chance for and greater mutations; Pleasurable sex means that it is more likely to be enacted thus increasing the chance for passing on your genes. It also allows sex to be given as a sign of trust and friendship, since when you have sex with someone you are (Hopefully!) giving them pleasure and them doing the same to you, you also trust them when you do this, A women trusts that a man will help to raise child etc if she becomes pregnant. This allows for stable reproductive relationships to occur, which in turn allows for society to arise from this. Also animals do not have a duty to nature, non-human animals cannot even understand the concept of “duty”. For example it is proven that predators will hunt out their prey, thus misbalancing nature etc etc. |
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05-12-2002, 03:29 PM | #77 | |
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But love the pic of Abaddon the Despoiler, did you just crop it from a pic of him and resize it?[/QUOTE]It’s directly linked from the games-workshop website, I think they cropped and shrunk it from one of their commissioned pics. They’ve got vast amounts of some of the best commercial artwork I’ve seen for a long time at their website. Too much on the space marines though (as ever). Also I cannot help noticing yer Sig, Hammer & Sickle + the female appears to form that shape with her pose, a postmodern Ironic reference or something? Yet what exactly is the significance of CCCP on it? Since many hold that it was ideologically and practically impure and it was deeply flawed because it based its polices upon the centralized control and restriction of information etc etc and was oreintated towards 2nd wave rather than 3rd. |
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05-12-2002, 03:30 PM | #78 | |||||||||
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“Obviously we cannot all go round indulging in our desires all the time as organised society would be collapse, so our desires are better served by co-operation and negotiation and compromise, but there is no need to Believe in illusions.” If a people do not want children to molested, they will co-operate to ensure than anyone who does molest children is punished. This is called “Law”, which are rules that the state enacts, and what is the state but a monopoly on power. Quote:
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But FYI: "Sex organs are homogenous, the scrotum is just sealed together labia from the stock fetal pre-female form, males have a tiny, 1/8 inch hymen sealed off in a pocket just below the bladder... The clitoris is simply a mutated Penis..." Quote:
“One of the highest members of the Mormon hierarchy declares that "A lesbian daughter [and presumably a gay son] could not remain in the church" (Apostle Richard G. Scott, "A Traditional Unit that Comes in Many Different Forms," LA Times, 9 Sep. 1997.)” “The US House of Representatives voted July 19 to approve the Bush administration’s “faith-based” initiative, which funnels billions in federal funds to church-based charities, while giving such groups the legal right to engage in discrimination on the basis of religion, sexual orientation or marital status.” “Well, true to form, the Baptists (The article is talking about the southern Baptist convention) have managed to outdo themselves again. At their 2000 Convention, they decided that women should no longer be allowed to serve as pastors.” “The Salvation Army hires gay people, but rejects them for the ministry. According to a spokesman for the church group, it opposes granting domestic partnership benefits “whether for homosexual or unmarried heterosexual couples” on the grounds that sex outside of marriage is immoral” (The Salvation Army doesn’t support same sex marriage) There’s a lot more if you want it… Quote:
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There is no proof that will stand up to scientific analysis that can prove that god exists, your logic is “you cannot prove that god doesn’t exists, so he must exist” this does not follow. Therefore the burden of proof is on you since you are basing your argeuments around the existence of god. Quote:
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Ad Hominem attack [ 05-12-2002, 03:42 PM: Message edited by: Dramnek_Ulk ] |
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05-12-2002, 03:54 PM | #79 | ||||
Ma'at - Goddess of Truth & Justice
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You and I don't believe in God, doesn't mean he doesn't exist, what if we are wrong, however difficult a concept that is for you to grasp. Quote:
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If they have no sense of duty to nature, a part of which is evolution, why then do animal who don't have sex for pleasure have sex at all?? They wouldn't at all, and I don't mean duty by our standards, I mean a deep-seated, implanted in their entire species duty. Why do you think plants reproduce?? I doubt they find much pleasure in pollination, it's because nature dictates that their existecne is to procreate, and in another sense, they are more dutiful to nature than we could ever know. And as far as animals hunting prey?? How does that unbalance nature?? That is another fundamental part of nature... do you think animals invented the food chain for fun?? All in all, after looking at your arguments, I think I know your basic problem (and logically my analysis is less likely to be biased because I mostly agree with you, and my view isn't clouded by the fact that you are of sifferetn opinion to me.) I think that you have real trouble accepting other's views, and that you are convinced that your views are right, I don't know why, maybe you are the selfish one, I don't know exactly, but you never put 'I think' or 'In my opinion' you always put definites in places where it is entirely a matter of opinion, or totally unknowable. You are a very presumptuous man, and I'm sorry that you can't be a little more tolerant of the fact that you might be wrong. Pity though, you are a very good debater otherwise. [ 05-12-2002, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: Talthyr Malkaviel ]
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Resident cantankerous sorcerer of the Clan HADB<br />and Sorcerous Nuttella salesman of the O.R.T<br /> <br /><br />Say NO to the Trouser Tyranny! Can I drill you about this? |
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05-12-2002, 04:13 PM | #80 | |
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I love this particular argument and I BELIEVE, I have FAITH in, that it is true and logical [img]tongue.gif[/img] |
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