09-16-2006, 08:36 AM | #1 |
Zartan
Join Date: May 2, 2001
Location: Ulpia Noviomagus Batavorum
Age: 43
Posts: 5,281
|
Hi there,
Overloaded with work as I am, I somehow have to find the time to get a number of people to fill out a questionnaire on a Linguistics-related subject and analyse the results - and that's where I wanted to ask you for help. [img]smile.gif[/img] As the title suggests, I'm mainly looking for people who don't speak English in their daily lives. The reason for this is quite simple - I need people for this questionnaire who have two different versions of the second person singular "you" in their native language, a formal and an informal one. So, for example, in French there's a distinction between "tu" for informal occasions and "vous" for formal ones; in German you've got "Du" (informal) and "Sie" (formal), in Dutch "jij" (informal) en "U" (formal). I'm trying to get an idea of when people tend to use the formal "you" and when the informal equivalent. I will refer to this particular distinction below with the French version, Tu/Vous, but feel free to use the Latvian/Bulgarian/Dutch/Swedish/Danish/etc equivalent instead. [img]smile.gif[/img] I'd really appreciate it if you could give me a hand with the questionnaire below. Under A only a simple "tu" or "vous" (or the equivalents in your own native tongue) is sufficient. Under B a simple "yes" or "no" is sufficient, though if you feel a more detailed answer is necessary then feel free to do so. [img]smile.gif[/img] Finally, there's a number of open questions under C that you can answer in any way you see fit. Thanks in advance! [img]smile.gif[/img] Male/Female: Age: Nationality: Occupation: A With which form are you usually addressed? · By parents · By grandparents · In secondary school · By professors · By students · By people over 50 · By unfamiliar children · In a pub Which do you normally use · To your parents · To your grandparents · To sec. school teachers · To university professore · To students over 40 · To younsters B Is it okay to be addressed Tu · In advertisements · On election posters · By professors · By students · In a newspaper Is it okay to be addressed Vous · By professors · By younger people (younger than 18) · By older students (40+) · By students your age · By acquaintance of your parents · By former teacher C · Are there situations you’re not sure which to use? · Have you ever felt uncomfortable when addressed Tu/Vous? · Do you ever say Vous, being addressed Tu in return?
__________________
[url]\"http://www.audioscrobbler.com/user/Grobbel/\" target=\"_blank\"> [img]\"http://www.denness.net/rpi/username/Grobbel\" alt=\" - \" /></a> |
09-16-2006, 08:53 AM | #2 | |
Harper
Join Date: October 6, 2001
Location: Iceland
Posts: 4,706
|
Quote:
|
|
09-16-2006, 10:33 AM | #3 |
Ironworks Moderator
Join Date: June 27, 2001
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Age: 43
Posts: 6,763
|
Male/Female: Male
Age: 25 Nationality: French canadian Occupation: Yes A With which form are you usually addressed? · By parents: Tu · By grandparents: Tu · In secondary school: Tu · By professors: Depends on the teacher. · By students: Tu · By people over 50: Vous mostly I think, but they use Vous for pretty much everyone. · By unfamiliar children: mostly Tu, but some have used Vous, mostly when they want something. · In a pub: Tu . (by cops): Vous most of the time Which do you normally use · To your parents: Tu · To your grandparents: Tu · To sec. school teachers: Tu · To university professore: Tu · To students over 40: Tu · To younsters: Tu B Is it okay to be addressed Tu (Are you asking my oponion, or what tend to be the norm? Personally it doesn't matter to me and I think to most people either, except the old people that live in another generation still) · In advertisements: They almost always use vous · On election posters: I don't remember ever being directly adressed by an election poster, it's usually a generic "Vote for X" or another such slogan. · By professors: Students don't mind being called either. · By students: Vous is deferential and usually impersonal, so if a student adressed another one with vous it would be strange, and he might get teased. · In a newspaper: They usually use vous Is it okay to be addressed Vous · By professors: Yes · By younger people (younger than 18): Yes · By older students (40+): Yes · By students your age: No · By acquaintance of your parents: Depends on age · By former teacher: Yes C · Are there situations you’re not sure which to use? I never use vous. · Have you ever felt uncomfortable when addressed Tu/Vous? When I was 19-20 a teenaged girl of 16-17 used vous when she asked me for cigarettes (which she didn't get). It felt strange as we were almost the same age, but she was trying to flatter me. · Do you ever say Vous, being addressed Tu in return? I never say vous, but usually when one person has to use vous the other has too for the same reasons but inversed. (Difference in age/status...) You're supposed to use vous when being formal, or when adressing someone of lower or higher status, but like I said it's not really in use anymore. Old people, as well as those in social positions like cops/politicians/McDonald girl use vous. Some teachers do but it's not that important, since most young people don't care and don't use vous. Most ads and journals use it, but they want to appear proper and professional. In a formal letter you use vous in a regular one you use tu. Really I don't think there is much difference with english. Situations that would require you to be formal in english would require you to be formal in french too. [ 09-16-2006, 10:37 AM: Message edited by: Luvian ]
__________________
Once upon a time in Canada... |
09-16-2006, 11:55 AM | #4 |
Apophis
Join Date: July 29, 2003
Location: The Underdark cavern of Zagreb
Age: 37
Posts: 4,679
|
Male/Female: male
Age: 19.9 Nationality: Croat Occupation: Student/pending employment Official: vi(means both an official or respectful you, and a plural) Unofficial: ti In my language, the official/respectful adress of a single person is usually done by making it a plural. Ja, ti, on, which means me, you, him, turns into mi, vi, oni, or we, you, them. A With which form are you usually addressed? · By parents ti · By grandparents ti · In secondary school vi · By professors vi · By students ti · By people over 50 ti/vi · By unfamiliar children ti/vi · In a pub ti/vi Which do you normally use · To your parents ti · To your grandparents ti · To sec. school teachers ti · To university professore vi · To students over 40 vi · To younsters ti B Is it okay to be addressed Ti · In advertisements yes · On election posters yes · By professors yes, in some circumstances · By students yes · In a newspaper yes Is it okay to be addressed Vous · By professorsyes · By younger people (younger than 18) yes · By older students (40+) yes · By students your age yes · By acquaintance of your parents yes · By former teacher yes C · Are there situations you’re not sure which to use? In situations where one is unsure, one should always use the official/respectful form. · Have you ever felt uncomfortable when addressed Tu/Vous? Yes, when I first started college, first time a professor addressed me as Vi was a bit of a shocker. · Do you ever say Vous, being addressed Tu in return? Yes, in grade school and high school this is a normal occurence, as well as in some other areas. Often it is not meant as disrespect in return, but as a sign of closeness or friendship.
__________________
MAKE LOVE, NOT SPAM! |
09-16-2006, 05:13 PM | #5 |
Baaz Draconian
Join Date: May 2, 2005
Location: Finland
Posts: 789
|
Male/Female:Male
Age:14 Nationality:Finnish-Swede (Swedish language) Occupation: - A With which form are you usually addressed? · By parents - Tu · By grandparents - Tu · In secondary school - Tu · By professors - Vous · By students - Tu · By people over 50 - Tu · By unfamiliar children - Tu · In a pub - Tu Which do you normally use · To your parents - Tu · To your grandparents - Tu · To sec. school teachers - Tu · To university professore - Tu · To students over 40 - Tu · To younsters - Tu B Is it okay to be addressed Tu · In advertisements - Y · On election posters - Y · By professors - Y · By students - Y · In a newspaper - Y Is it okay to be addressed Vous · By professors - Y · By younger people (younger than 18) - Y · By older students (40+) - Y · By students your age - Y · By acquaintance of your parents - Y · By former teacher - Y C · Are there situations you’re not sure which to use? Yes, the first time I was at a meeting. · Have you ever felt uncomfortable when addressed Tu/Vous? No. · Do you ever say Vous, being addressed Tu in return? Sure, but since language is pretty loose around me, I don't really care. But if they insist on being assholes then I'm gonna get upset...
__________________
Let it not be said that it was done out of pride |
09-17-2006, 02:37 AM | #6 |
Zartan
Join Date: May 2, 2001
Location: Ulpia Noviomagus Batavorum
Age: 43
Posts: 5,281
|
Thanks so far, keep them coming! [img]smile.gif[/img] I'm going to analyze the results in about 15 hours from now. [img]smile.gif[/img]
[ 09-17-2006, 02:37 AM: Message edited by: Grojlach ] |
09-17-2006, 03:24 AM | #7 |
Legion Symbol
Join Date: February 14, 2002
Location: Ireland
Age: 39
Posts: 7,367
|
In Poland the informal is 'ty', for formal usage you adress the person in third person. (instead of "where have you been?" you say "where has sir been?"). I'll be using french for simplicity.
Male/Female: male Age: 22 Nationality: Syrian/Polish Occupation: student With which form are you usually addressed? · By parents tu · By grandparents tu · In secondary school tu · By professors vous · By students tu · By people over 50 vous · By unfamiliar children vous · In a pub tu Which do you normally use · To your parents tu · To your grandparents tu · To sec. school teachers vous · To university professore vous · To students over 40 tu · To younsters tu B Is it okay to be addressed Tu · In advertisements yes · On election posters yes · By professors they usually use vous for students, though I've met quite a few using tu and its okay. · By students yes · In a newspaper yes Is it okay to be addressed Vous · By professors yes · By younger people (younger than 18) yes · By older students (40+) no. students use tu to each other no matter what age. · By students your age no · By acquaintance of your parents. varies, but it is ok I suppose. · By former teacher. depends on whether he used tu or vous when he was your teacher before. C · Are there situations you’re not sure which to use? yes. use vous, until your sure you can use tu. Using vous instead of tu is no big offense. The other way round it could be insulting. · Have you ever felt uncomfortable when addressed Tu/Vous? not really. · Do you ever say Vous, being addressed Tu in return? yes. e.g to professors.
__________________
ZFR |
09-17-2006, 03:36 AM | #8 |
Legion Symbol
Join Date: February 14, 2002
Location: Ireland
Age: 39
Posts: 7,367
|
Now for Syria. In Arabic the informal is "inta". In Syria to use formal you say an Arabic word which mean "your presence". Again I'll use French for simplicity
Male/Female: male Age: 22 Nationality: Syrian/Polish Occupation: student A With which form are you usually addressed? · By parents tu · By grandparents tu · In secondary school tu · By professors (not sure haven't studied there but I'd say tu, could be vous) · By students tu · By people over 50 tu · By unfamiliar children tu · In a pub tu Which do you normally use · To your parents tu · To your grandparents tu · To sec. school teachers tu · To university professore (I believe vous, haven't studied there) · To students over 40 I think tu. You won't find such old students there as much as in Europe. · To younsters tu B Is it okay to be addressed Tu · In advertisements yes · On election posters yes · By professors yes (not 100% sure) · By students yes · In a newspaper yes Is it okay to be addressed Vous · By professors yes (again not 100% sure) · By younger people (younger than 18) no · By older students (40+) no · By students your age no · By acquaintance of your parents no · By former teacher no C · Are there situations you’re not sure which to use? yes. Older strangers. · Have you ever felt uncomfortable when addressed Tu/Vous? no. · Do you ever say Vous, being addressed Tu in return? yes. quite common when adressing older people. The above is for Syria only, not all countries using Arabic.
__________________
ZFR |
09-17-2006, 09:11 AM | #9 |
Zhentarim Guard
Join Date: December 19, 2003
Location: sweden
Age: 38
Posts: 381
|
My mother tongue is Swedish and I can't imagine a situation where I would use, or hear, the formal version of you, "Ni". Maybe if I was speaking to the King on television.
__________________
[url]\"http://www.universalpoplab.com\" target=\"_blank\">Universal Poplab</a> |
09-17-2006, 02:12 PM | #10 | |
Baaz Draconian
Join Date: May 2, 2005
Location: Finland
Posts: 789
|
Quote:
__________________
Let it not be said that it was done out of pride |
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Looking for a tutor on IW (native spanish-speaking) | Larry_OHF | General Discussion | 2 | 02-25-2006 10:47 PM |
Native American Sovereignty | Chewbacca | General Discussion | 15 | 07-17-2003 07:13 PM |
The Peyote Ritual in Native American Religion | antryg | General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) | 5 | 01-05-2003 05:53 PM |
For none english speakers about Manuals.. | WOLFGIR | General Discussion | 19 | 05-30-2001 10:06 AM |
Non-native English speakers?!? | Moridin | General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) | 125 | 05-18-2001 10:28 AM |