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Old 12-10-2004, 06:22 AM   #21
Variol (Farseer) Elmwood
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Join Date: May 16, 2003
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I wish people would speak my language at times. Nobdy seems to get me most of the time.

Variety is the spice of life! An English opera just wouldn't cut it IMHO
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Old 12-10-2004, 07:08 AM   #22
Vaskez
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Quote:
Originally posted by wellard:
quote:
Originally posted by Aelia Jusa:


Schools I think need to be more consistent with teaching other languages and there needs to be more congruency between lower and upper schooling so that kids learn one other language well rather than pointless spatterings of a number of different languages. The problem in English-speaking countries is, though, there isn't a clear obvious second language to teach, so schools end up offering a number of different languages, or the language taught at primary school is not the same as the one taught at high school. In non-English speaking countries, there is a much more clear choice for a second language.
I had not thought of that before Aelia, but it is so true. Maybe this is an underlying reason for English speaking people being lazy in taking up the challenge of a foreign language. What should I choose as a language for my kids down here in Australia? Chinese, Japanese, Spanish, Indonesian or ??? There is no obvious choice as you say. [img]graemlins/1ponder.gif[/img] Not an easy choice is it?

As posted by Grojlach "On a similar note, linguists predict that by the end of this century, 75 to 90 percent of the 5000 current languages will have died out." I have heard this before and I believe many of those languages are Aboriginal and Papua New Guinean languages. This really makes me sad, If it was my culture I would be angry about it.

Is it a form of imperial arrogance? Do members of this forum get annoyed that it is English based or so many films and TV and music for that matter, or just accept it as given without a second thought?
[/QUOTE]I'd say Chinese, Japanese, OR Spanish would all be useful for your kid. Not much point in learning Indonesian, unless you plan to live there. Ok kind of the same for Japanese, but it is a more important industrial power. Chinese is a world language since chinese are everywhere, but it's not officially the language anywhere except in China, and maybe one or two other places like Malaysia (?) Spanish is the official language in many more countries, so maybe that is the most generally useful one for your kids.

I'd still like to know why they predict the growth of german in Asia?? Anyone know? I am thinking of taking German back up as I studied it for 6 years before.

As for TV programs and films: no one has a right to be angry about most of them being english, since America produces most films and the native language there is english, so why SHOULD they produce it in another language and alienate their own audience??? That would be stupid...
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Old 12-10-2004, 08:26 AM   #23
johnny
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Quote:
Originally posted by Variol (Farseer) Elmwood:
I wish people would speak my language at times. Nobdy seems to get me most of the time.

Variety is the spice of life! An English opera just wouldn't cut it IMHO
Sorry dude, but Wookiee talk is simply too hard for most of us.
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Old 12-10-2004, 01:47 PM   #24
Irongrinder
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Join Date: June 8, 2001
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Quote:
Originally posted by Q'alooaith:
When you get youngsters growing up bilingual you start to see the decay in barriers between lanuages, words cross back and forth untill they speak a tsa-sui that only they understand..

Though that's not bad either because no one feel's left out.
I think you're more referring to streetslang. I don't think that has anything to do with being bilingual. When I look at a lot of youngsters around the neighbourhood here I see they use a lot of words from the english language, but when you try to get them to speak English, nothing good comes out, or it's with a big accent. It's more like a fashion to them.

The only one I know who mixes up a lot of words from the Dutch, German and English language without using slang, is my mother with her German background. Guess that happens when you teach German and English every day and live in Holland
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Old 12-10-2004, 03:22 PM   #25
Bungleau
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One of my big regrets is that in high school, when I wanted to add Spanish in my junior year (grade 11), I let the school counselor talk me out of it. I was already taking French (third year), and he convinced me that they were different enough that learning Spanish would mess up my French.

When I got to college, I picked it up there, and on the contrary, my French messed up my Spanish [img]smile.gif[/img]

In my somewhat limited experience, European teachers focused on speaking and listening, while American teachers focused on reading and writing. Problem is, you can think as much as you need to when you're reading and writing. You can't do that in conversation, so American-style teaching results in a lesser ability to communicate. And students taught American-style are less able to help others learn to speak and listen to the language.

I remember the first time I went to Montreal after I'd learned French. That's when I found out that many of the rules I'd learned didn't really apply. For example, the "u" in "tu as" (you have) is never dropped, according to the rules. In practical speech, however, I don't think it's ever there.

I now speak French mostly fluently, Spanish passably, German bearably, and sign language (ASL) partially. I continue to encourage my kids to learn more languages. It only helps.
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Old 12-10-2004, 05:17 PM   #26
Lucern
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Quote:
(Larry_OHF) I am glad for my ability to speak Spanish, and use it very frequently here in the South, where a white boy that speaks anything besideshis native language is a marvel to behold. I want to learn other languages, but the resources are not here for me.
I know how you feel Larry. Isn't it great? I speak French, and while much less useful in the US than Spanish, imagine the freakish looks I get when I proclaim that I speak it. Especially in a country where parts of it started referring to Freedom Fries lol. It's like an act of defiance.

I'd also like to point out that learning another language makes one more aware of the meanings, constructions, and strange expressions of their first language. It worked that way for me anyway.

Quote:
(Wellard) Is it a form of imperial arrogance? Do members of this forum get annoyed that it is English based or so many films and TV and music for that matter, or just accept it as given without a second thought?
Aside from the practical aspect of English being so common, I think it's worthwhile to consider the link between language and power. The spread of a language can be seen as a form of cultural hegemony. There is culture and meaning throughout all languages, and the dominance of one comes at the cost of the other and its culture. I too am happy to see languages thrive, as it is a resistance to this; I am also sad to see others die out.

A simple example of what I am talking about in Wellard's part of the world. Is it generally more advantageous to speak an indigenous language in Australia or English? It'd be nice to know both, but that won't happen in enough people - the society won't put the languages or those who speak them on equal footing.

There are practical reasons for what people do (including arts and music in English), but there are cultural consequences, whether they're intended or not. *Closes anthropology book*
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Old 12-11-2004, 03:50 AM   #27
wellard
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lucern:

A simple example of what I am talking about in Wellard's part of the world. Is it generally more advantageous to speak an indigenous language in Australia or English? It'd be nice to know both, but that won't happen in enough people - the society won't put the languages or those who speak them on equal footing.

There are practical reasons for what people do (including arts and music in English), but there are cultural consequences, whether they're intended or not. *Closes anthropology book*
The failure of Aboriginal languages in Australia is mainly (but not solely) down to the fact that there are hundreds of them and they vary wildly across the continent. Ernie Dingo, a well known Aboriginal TV star down here, made a most telling comment once when he was talking to some white folk about our ignorance of aboriginal speech. He asked this large group of white Australians to say yes or no in as many languages as possible, People responded in French, Russian, Italian, German, Spanish etc, then he asked them to say yes or no in just one Aboriginal language..... Not one person could [img]graemlins/heee.gif[/img] Sad really.
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