Man, HOW and TotLM are HARD! (minor spoilers inside)

Jerry_Seinfeld · 01-31-2005, 09:33 PM

alright everyone, I am currently in Dragons eye, and am playing through on insane, and this is my first time through the game with any mods, patches or HOW and TotLM installed. So far everything has been going smoothly (Cept for the 4 ogres in the first dungeon, I mean FOUR ogres that early??) but I cant beat the fight where you have to rescue that priest guy in the bottem left place of the second level of DE. Ive tried everything, and the thing is, I STILL can't beat it when I turn the game difficulty back to normal. I mean, shouldnt level 7-8 guys be a breeze through anything in DE on normal?? I am getting really bummed, can anyone give me some advice for this fight?? I mean, there are just SO many trolls. Or is HOW and TotLM always this hard, or is it just insane that add extra guys?

Aerich · 02-01-2005, 01:22 AM

Nah, you haven't hit the REALLY fun bits yet.

Just kidding. Ain't insane fun? More monsters that do more damage (which is a function of the difficulty level), and as it's your first time through with HoW installed, you get the call-to-arms feature as well. It can be a shock.

*Minor tactical spoilers
*
*

My best advice is to cast disabling spells. Cast some of Web, Entangle, Stinking Cloud and/or Grease in the narrow passageway leading into the troll & priest area. Spike Growth is good, too.

Take your best tank, preferably one with a bow, equip him/her with a ring of free action (which you did pickpocket in Kuldahar, right?) or drink a free action potion. Go draw the trolls and priests by running around that altar-pyramid thing. Make sure that you don't get surrounded. Free action takes away the priests' favourite spell (Hold Person) and makes you immune to your own 'capturing' spells. Draw your "followers" into the passageway until they get stuck; the trick is to cast the spells a few steps before your decoy ducks into the passageway. That gives you the longest duration, but hopefully catches the first wave of enemies. Hammer them with missiles and spells; two fireballs should be enough to take out the trolls. It's just a matter of getting them to stick around in the same place so you can kill a bunch at once.

It also helps to cast Protection From Fire on your melee characters, at least the ones who will be blocking the passageway. A summoning or animate dead spell is good fodder to stick in the middle of your spell trap, as any monsters that make their saves will attack your summons instead of your party.

To sum up, this fight can be rather easy if you: use the terrain, draw the trolls into a trap, use summons, use fire spells, use disabling spells, and use other (clerical) spells to buff your party and reduce the saves of the enemy. Don't stint on those little fire pots, either. In such tight quarters, and with AoE spells going off, you may be able to finish 2-5 trolls with one pot.

Edit: this tactic, and variations on it, will serve you excellently, if you aren't using it already.

[ 02-01-2005, 01:24 AM: Message edited by: Aerich ]

NobleNick · 02-01-2005, 10:18 AM

Jerry_Seinfeld,

No, it is not HoW that is doing you in (other than the "call to arms" feature complicates things). It is HoF insane mode that is wasting you. (Just wait until you get to HoW and TotLM in HoF insane mode. Man!! I'm sure I can't even imagine the pain...)

Below are some formulas I've seen posted about what HoF does to you. (I do not know what HoF setting(s) this is good for, but GUESS that it is for insane. Aerich, Dundee, what difficulty settings is the below good for?)

XP from monsters: HoF XP = ((normal IWD/HoW XP) x 4) + 2000.
HP of monsters: HoF HP = ((normal IWD/HoW HP) x 4) + 80.
Damage from monsters: HoF Damage = (normal IWD/HoW Damage) x 4

Hey, wait: You are playing on HoF --INSANE-- mode and complaining about how hard it is? Quit your whining and sit your butt back down in front of the keyboard...

Seriously, although I haven't played on HoF, I have played DE2 enough times to know that Aerich is right on with his tactical advice: Use that long narrow passageway to bunch 'em and burn 'em!

--------------------
What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!

[ 02-01-2005, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: NobleNick ]

ZFR · 02-01-2005, 10:48 AM

I think he's playing it on insane only without HoF

Marty4 · 02-01-2005, 10:58 AM

My advice for that fight? Solo a Cleric/Ranger

Of course, if you don't want to do that

, then just follow Aerich's advice with grouping them and burning them. Just be sure not to fry Egenia [img]smile.gif[/img] Also, for free action, you can use a charge of the Mantle of the Coming Storm.

Jerry_Seinfeld · 02-01-2005, 08:55 PM

Yeah, right now this is normal on insane. Not at HOF yet though I intend to go there

Right now, my mage only has 2 lvl 3 spells, and which do you think is most important, 1 haste and 1 fireball, or 2 fireballs. Also how could I forget the rings of free action? What level spell is entangle? Right now my only clerical caster is a ranger/cleric and is only up to lvl 3 spells right now. Thanks for the advice everybody, I'm gonna go have another go at those trolls.

Marty4 · 02-01-2005, 09:34 PM

I believe that entangle is level one, but only druids can cast it. I would go with 1 fireball and 1 haste, as haste is just SO much fun. The talonite priests can be annoying with Hold Person and Silence, but having one of your guys whip out a sling or bow and pegging him full of ammo will really put a damper on that spellcasting

. Remember that Egenia knows resurrection, so if you are having trouble and win with one death, you can always get your guy back.

Also, Egenia helps in other ways. Once, she decided to randomly roam the area in my file, and wound up plugging a chokepoint when I was fleeing from a horde of spiders and beetles. The noble fiends wouldn't dare harm a poor, defensless old woman!

Dundee Slaytern · 02-01-2005, 09:40 PM

He ain't playing on HoF mode. You can't realistically be only at level 7-8 at Dragon's Eye if you are playing on HoF mode.

On HoF mode, you will have access to a lot of mid-level Priest spells by that point. The spell carnage at that area is usually very intense.

NobleNick · 02-02-2005, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dundee Slaytern:
He ain't playing on HoF mode. You can't realistically be only at level 7-8 at Dragon's Eye if you are playing on HoF mode.

I thought that would be low, but didn't say anything because, as I freely admit, my game difficulty is firmly stuck on NORMAL (or whatever the defualt setting is: I don't even visit often enough to know what the setting names are!

Hey, Dundee, don't look now; but your message odometer is into 5 digits...

--------------------
What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!

Dundee Slaytern · 02-03-2005, 02:19 AM

I post too much sometimes.

01-31-2005, 09:33 PM	#1
Jerry_Seinfeld The Magister Join Date: December 9, 2004 Location: VA Age: 36 Posts: 114	alright everyone, I am currently in Dragons eye, and am playing through on insane, and this is my first time through the game with any mods, patches or HOW and TotLM installed. So far everything has been going smoothly (Cept for the 4 ogres in the first dungeon, I mean FOUR ogres that early??) but I cant beat the fight where you have to rescue that priest guy in the bottem left place of the second level of DE. Ive tried everything, and the thing is, I STILL can't beat it when I turn the game difficulty back to normal. I mean, shouldnt level 7-8 guys be a breeze through anything in DE on normal?? I am getting really bummed, can anyone give me some advice for this fight?? I mean, there are just SO many trolls. Or is HOW and TotLM always this hard, or is it just insane that add extra guys? __________________ <img border=\"0\" alt=\"[monster3]\" title=\"\" src=\"graemlins/monster3.gif\" />

02-01-2005, 01:22 AM	#2
Aerich Lord Ao Join Date: May 27, 2004 Location: Canada Age: 42 Posts: 2,061	Nah, you haven't hit the REALLY fun bits yet. Just kidding. Ain't insane fun? More monsters that do more damage (which is a function of the difficulty level), and as it's your first time through with HoW installed, you get the call-to-arms feature as well. It can be a shock. Minor tactical spoilers * My best advice is to cast disabling spells. Cast some of Web, Entangle, Stinking Cloud and/or Grease in the narrow passageway leading into the troll & priest area. Spike Growth is good, too. Take your best tank, preferably one with a bow, equip him/her with a ring of free action (which you did pickpocket in Kuldahar, right?) or drink a free action potion. Go draw the trolls and priests by running around that altar-pyramid thing. Make sure that you don't get surrounded. Free action takes away the priests' favourite spell (Hold Person) and makes you immune to your own 'capturing' spells. Draw your "followers" into the passageway until they get stuck; the trick is to cast the spells a few steps before your decoy ducks into the passageway. That gives you the longest duration, but hopefully catches the first wave of enemies. Hammer them with missiles and spells; two fireballs should be enough to take out the trolls. It's just a matter of getting them to stick around in the same place so you can kill a bunch at once. It also helps to cast Protection From Fire on your melee characters, at least the ones who will be blocking the passageway. A summoning or animate dead spell is good fodder to stick in the middle of your spell trap, as any monsters that make their saves will attack your summons instead of your party. To sum up, this fight can be rather easy if you: use the terrain, draw the trolls into a trap, use summons, use fire spells, use disabling spells, and use other (clerical) spells to buff your party and reduce the saves of the enemy. Don't stint on those little fire pots, either. In such tight quarters, and with AoE spells going off, you may be able to finish 2-5 trolls with one pot. Edit: this tactic, and variations on it, will serve you excellently, if you aren't using it already. [ 02-01-2005, 01:24 AM: Message edited by: Aerich ] __________________ Where there is a great deal of free speech, there is always a certain amount of foolish speech. - Winston S. Churchill

02-01-2005, 10:48 AM	#4
ZFR Legion Symbol Join Date: February 14, 2002 Location: Ireland Age: 39 Posts: 7,367	I think he's playing it on insane only without HoF __________________ ZFR

02-01-2005, 08:55 PM	#6
Jerry_Seinfeld The Magister Join Date: December 9, 2004 Location: VA Age: 36 Posts: 114	Yeah, right now this is normal on insane. Not at HOF yet though I intend to go there Right now, my mage only has 2 lvl 3 spells, and which do you think is most important, 1 haste and 1 fireball, or 2 fireballs. Also how could I forget the rings of free action? What level spell is entangle? Right now my only clerical caster is a ranger/cleric and is only up to lvl 3 spells right now. Thanks for the advice everybody, I'm gonna go have another go at those trolls. __________________ <img border=\"0\" alt=\"[monster3]\" title=\"\" src=\"graemlins/monster3.gif\" />

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02-01-2005, 10:18 AM	#3
NobleNick Quintesson Join Date: February 5, 2002 Location: Huntsville, AL, USA Age: 63 Posts: 1,045	Jerry_Seinfeld, No, it is not HoW that is doing you in (other than the "call to arms" feature complicates things). It is HoF insane mode that is wasting you. (Just wait until you get to HoW and TotLM in HoF insane mode. Man!! I'm sure I can't even imagine the pain...) Below are some formulas I've seen posted about what HoF does to you. (I do not know what HoF setting(s) this is good for, but GUESS that it is for insane. Aerich, Dundee, what difficulty settings is the below good for?) XP from monsters: HoF XP = ((normal IWD/HoW XP) x 4) + 2000. HP of monsters: HoF HP = ((normal IWD/HoW HP) x 4) + 80. Damage from monsters: HoF Damage = (normal IWD/HoW Damage) x 4 Hey, wait: You are playing on HoF *--INSANE--* mode and complaining about how hard it is? Quit your whining and sit your butt back down in front of the keyboard... Seriously, although I haven't played on HoF, I have played DE2 enough times to know that Aerich is right on with his tactical advice: Use that long narrow passageway to bunch 'em and burn 'em! -------------------- What's a party, without a song? Bards ROCK! Party On!! [ 02-01-2005, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: NobleNick ]

02-01-2005, 10:58 AM	#5
Marty4 Symbol of Cyric Join Date: August 31, 2004 Location: VA Age: 33 Posts: 1,127	My advice for that fight? Solo a Cleric/Ranger Of course, if you don't want to do that , then just follow Aerich's advice with grouping them and burning them. Just be sure not to fry Egenia [img]smile.gif[/img] Also, for free action, you can use a charge of the Mantle of the Coming Storm.

02-01-2005, 09:34 PM	#7
Marty4 Symbol of Cyric Join Date: August 31, 2004 Location: VA Age: 33 Posts: 1,127	I believe that entangle is level one, but only druids can cast it. I would go with 1 fireball and 1 haste, as haste is just SO much fun. The talonite priests can be annoying with Hold Person and Silence, but having one of your guys whip out a sling or bow and pegging him full of ammo will really put a damper on that spellcasting . Remember that Egenia knows resurrection, so if you are having trouble and win with one death, you can always get your guy back. Also, Egenia helps in other ways. Once, she decided to randomly roam the area in my file, and wound up plugging a chokepoint when I was fleeing from a horde of spiders and beetles. The noble fiends wouldn't dare harm a poor, defensless old woman!

02-01-2005, 09:40 PM	#8
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 41 Posts: 11,063	He ain't playing on HoF mode. You can't realistically be only at level 7-8 at Dragon's Eye if you are playing on HoF mode. On HoF mode, you will have access to a lot of mid-level Priest spells by that point. The spell carnage at that area is usually very intense.

02-03-2005, 02:19 AM	#10
Dundee Slaytern Ironworks Moderator Join Date: June 10, 2001 Location: Pasir Ris, Singapore Age: 41 Posts: 11,063	I post too much sometimes.

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