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Old 06-27-2005, 09:10 AM   #1
Bungleau
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We're looking at a wireless fence for our new puppy. We've looked at two brands so far -- Invisible Fence and Pet Safe. Anyone got any thoughts, perspective, or experience on either one (or other alternatives)?

TIA [img]smile.gif[/img]
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Old 06-27-2005, 09:17 AM   #2
Callum
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Invisible fences? OOOOOOOH!

But won't the puppy keep banging into it without seeing it?
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Old 06-27-2005, 09:31 AM   #3
Arvon
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Haven't used the invisable fence for the many dogs we've had. Why not use a real fence or one of the dog runs that are premade. I think the invisable fences rely on shocking the dog which is a thing I'm not in favor of.
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Old 06-27-2005, 10:20 AM   #4
Cloudbringer
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Got to say I'm not impressed with them from experiences some friends have had. It's easy to cut the wires or have the power go off to the fence and NOT KNOW IT til you lose a dog.

Someone I know lost two of her dogs and they were killed on the highway....extremely sad! Seems a gardener had cut a wire and they hadn't realized it to fix it in time.

Another friend had hers get lost for a day when her power to the fence was cut and she didn't realize it. Drove them frantic looking for the pups. Her little boy was nearly inconsolable til they found them. She still likes and uses the fencing but is VERY paranoid about it working and plans to get a regular fence as soon as they can afford it in their new home.

So all in all, I'm more inclined to recommend a regulation fence but I realize cost may be an issue in that case. We've got a 6 ft privacy fence (cedar) so when we get a dog, my only concerns will be blocking the back corner where it's raised up half a foot to let water drain off the property and keeping the pup from digging up my plants!


Umm... I just realized you have 'wireless' in the topic...not sure about a totally wireless fence, only kind I know of have wires buried and use electronic pulses at that point to send a 'shock' to the dog's collar.

[ 06-27-2005, 10:21 AM: Message edited by: Cloudbringer ]
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Old 06-27-2005, 11:48 AM   #5
Bungleau
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Thanks for the feedback (even Callum ).

A little more info...

Invisible fence is a brand, like Kleenex. Unfortunately, I don't know what the name is for the generic category like "facial tissue" in this world, so "wireless fence" was my effort to come up with one. Since it has a wire, it's not a good choice

However, to address the things that have been brought up...

They are indeed buried in the ground, and they rely on a shock ("correction") for the dog when it goes past the line. They both use an audible beep to alert the dog that it's in the fence area; that, of course, is painless [img]smile.gif[/img]

Invisible fence (IF) has one setting for shock -- on or off. Pet Safe (PS) has ten, from mild (I felt a slight tingling) to potent. And it can be adjusted, depending on the dog's personality and tendencies.

They both rely on a wire buried in the ground. Obviously, that's a point of failure. PS has a signal in the base unit that tells you if the connection has been lost (the wire's been broken). To my knowledge, IF doesn't. PS can also come with a battery backup in case the power goes out.

Apparently, once the dog has been trained, he'll stay away from the perimeters on general principals. Other friends have talked about turning their fence off for a couple of months and the dog still behaving as if it were live.

A lot depends on the personality of the dog, apparently. I'm not sure if that's going to be good or bad yet

I think PS will bury the wire inside a PVC tube, so it's more protected from the elements. I don't believe that IF is planning on doing that. PS also planned to call MISS DIG, our local authority who will come out and identify all the underground wire and cabling runs so you can avoid them when doing work. IF didn't even mention that.

As for real fences, I used to have on in the back yard... and I hated it! A nice picket fence... with all the additional hassles of painting it ('cause the paint doesn't last, which may well be my fault) and trying to mow around it (which is just a royal pain). Of course, using the weed whacker to get the grass near the fence would chip away paint from the fence as well, so... not in my plans.

A dog run would be a possibility, but we'd lose a fair amount of the back yard. He's going to be a decent-sized dog when he grows up... 65-75 pounds or thereabouts. What's that... 30-35 kg?

So... I'm still interested in thoughts, opinions, and perspectives.

Thanks!
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Old 06-27-2005, 12:17 PM   #6
VulcanRider
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This is an alternative to a buried wire. Instead of getting a warning sound/shock when he gets to close to a wire, this goes off if he gets too far from a central point. I've never used either one so can't tell if they work. I just thought this might be easier to install than digging a trench around the yard.

Edit: is this the same Instant Fence you mentioned? This one specifies no underground wires required.

[ 06-27-2005, 12:20 PM: Message edited by: VulcanRider ]
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Old 06-27-2005, 12:28 PM   #7
Thoran
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I can think of two other problems with invisible fences... if the dog DOES go through it (chasing a rabbit for instance) it then can't get back in. The other is that invisible fencing doesn't keep other dogs out, which can be a problem if an agressive dog decides to go after yours... or if you have an agressive dog.
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Old 06-27-2005, 03:49 PM   #8
Bungleau
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Interesting link, Vulcan Rider. That's another product from the same company that goes at it from the other way -- instead of "stay out of here" it works on "stay in here". I may have to see if that's an option.

WRT real and radio fences (still trying to find that good word for them), I have no interest whatsoever in a real fence. Had one. Hated it. Not going back. [img]graemlins/nono.gif[/img] The differences between a real and radio fence are noted, but we don't view them as an issue here.

Part of the way a dog is trained with these fences is to learn where safety is. So if he goes beyond the fence, he knows that the way to safety is by the house, and he'll head back that way. The PS system has a secondary setting that covers dogs that run beyond the fence; it doesn't stop working, but keeps going, prompting him to go back to safety.

We're not going this alone, either. We're talking with friends, our vet, and our dog trainer to get their perspectives.
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Old 06-27-2005, 05:13 PM   #9
Lady Sedai
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Letter

Personally, I'm against "invisible fencing" the same way I'm against those "stop barking" shock collars.

First, it's just as easy to teach your dog the boundaries by leash training. I did that with my Josephine and she knows *exactly* where she's allowed to go and where not. And even if a dog goes by on the other side of the street and she *starts* to go after it, all I have to do is yell her name loudly and she stops in her tracks.

I'm a firm believer that proper training beats "babysitting" with these types of devices hands down.

Second, even *if* the invisible fence trains your dog, he/she can become used to the "zap" and learn to ignore it or tolerate it enough to get out of range of the fencing. Also, I'm not sure which type of fencing Thoran is referring to. I've never heard of something like that (invisible fencing that would let them get out, but not back in). But still, if the dog really gets a head of steam up (like the aforementioned chasing a rabbit), it'll just blow by the fenceline with a *yurk!* and keep on going.

Edit: Oh...and the fencing, if all goes well, may keep *your* dog in, but won't keep other dogs *out* and that could cause harm to your dog if you are not outside watching and he/she is attacked.

[ 06-27-2005, 05:21 PM: Message edited by: Lady Sedai ]
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Old 06-27-2005, 05:39 PM   #10
Lady Sedai
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bungleau:
{politely snipped}
Part of the way a dog is trained with these fences is to learn where safety is. So if he goes beyond the fence, he knows that the way to safety is by the house, and he'll head back that way. The PS system has a secondary setting that covers dogs that run beyond the fence; it doesn't stop working, but keeps going, prompting him to go back to safety.
See...this is one of the things I disagree with where this type of fence is concerned.

Nothing personal on you at all, Bungleau, just against the fencing.

I don't think it teaches them anything about where it's "safe". If it works on the particular dog, it only teaches them to fear the shock. Some dogs are smarter than others and *do* learn what is intended by these fences, but some are a bit slower and all they learn is that the collar around their neck hurts them when they go a certain distance from the house.

I don't agree with teaching a dog to obey through fear...of *anything* - even a collar.

Plus, the only real "success" stories I've heard of with invisible fencing has been with dogs that are already easy going and laid back (like Goldens).

Edited to note: This is just how *I* feel about it and not intended to be judgmental towards anyone who *does* use such a device for training. I've just never needed such methods to train any dog I've ever had and I've trained many for friends and neighbors as well.

[ 06-27-2005, 05:42 PM: Message edited by: Lady Sedai ]
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