disturbing art 2

[johnny]

I know there are lots of different artforms, but some don't deserve to be called art. Imo, this is one of them. If i take a dump, put the turd on a pedestal in the shape of a duck, would that be art ? I don't think so. Art should make people gaze and stand in awe, i don't think a few goldfish in a blender has that kind of effect.

[Bahamut]

Hey... please don't blend the fish.. I have pet fishes man. It angers me that some people do not really value the lives of other organisms.

[Dalamar Stormcrow]

While I wouldn't touch the button, if someone pushed the button, I'd laugh my ass off. I won't kill for a cheap laugh but if others will i'll join in. I don't see the big deal with the death of a goldfish, but a cat or dog would be a wee bit weird.


http://www.happytreefriends.com/watc...es/index.html#

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Pick any episode(Not for small kiddies or big babies)

[ 06-23-2004, 11:58 AM: Message edited by: Dalamar Stormcrow ]

[Aerich]

That's a good four-sentence summary, Absynthe. I think that it's a good thing that art is a tool for social and political criticism, although I disagree with those who think that is it's sole purpose (I like aesthetics, too).

I lean towards interpreting "art" as an all-encompassing medium of expression; however, what many so-called artists do not really understand or care about is the fact that their "art" will be nothing more than the product of their own imagination unless it can affect an audience in a more meaningful way than "that's gross/weird." I agree with what johnny says (my interpretation of it, anyway); that much of what we call art these days is so meaningless to the vast, vast majority of people that it is essentially of no value. (We disagree on the goldfish, however) I think that we can draw a line between "art" - a personal expression in some medium that does not merely serve a practical purpose, and "Art" - a personal expression... that in the eyes of many people is worthy of the name because of its aesthetic beauty or some other desirable quality. "Low art" and "High art", if you will. The line is blurry, is different for different people, and the categories have different levels of worthiness. I don't regard the psychological challenge of the goldfish-in-blender as worthless, although I do NOT like that they are killed to make a point.

I also don't think that it is a problem that art is used to teach (or challenge) morals and ethics. Morals and ethics ARE taught, although often by those we don't want to teach them. Role models are parents, teachers, religious figures, athletes, politicians, and all the people you can see on T.V. I never said they were good role models, or taught "good" ethics, but they teach nevertheless. Also, all of these CAN be laudatory moral figures, although they often are not. A person's morals are indicative of their worldview, which depends on many different sources, some bad, some good. If art is one of them, and it challenges people to think about their assumptions and the assumptions of their society, that's a good thing. Personally, I feel that art, as practiced by artists, is among the most minor influences on morality - movies are much more influential. We could call them art within the largest definition of the word, but we don't really view movies as works of art.

Feel free to disagree with me on any and all of these points! [img]smile.gif[/img]

[ 06-23-2004, 12:35 PM: Message edited by: Aerich ]

[Blind_Prophet]

Seriously is their no one else on this forum that is like me and thinks hey who cares its a gold fish no big deal. Someone pressed a button and killed a gold fish OH MY GOD big deal it was a gold fish. All you people crying saying your killing just to kill is just wrong, or its ok cause you eat what you kill next time you kill a bug in your house make sure you pry its body off the floor and have a lil snack...... Oh but a bug in my house thats differnt its an inconvinence killing is killing no matter what it is or what the purpose is don't pick and choose what kind of death for what kind of animal for what kind of purpose is ok. Heres a quick question for all of you people crying about how sick it is have you ever watched fear factor i'm sure at least one of you has. do you enjoy that show? Cause they blend of things all the time for shock and entertainment value how would liking that making you any different for blending a simple little gold fish.

Well thats my hastly written thoughts on that if you can make sence of it.

[johnny]

You're missing the point here, it's totally unnecessary to kill a goldfish to express his artistic talents. If that's the best he can come up with, he'd better start looking for a real job.

Fish die every day, i couldn't care less, but this isn't necessary.

[Blind_Prophet]

Originally posted by johnny: Fish die every day, i couldn't care less, but this isn't necessary.

Hmm those statments back to back like that sure make me belive it..... and i do see the point you not calling it art, which it is really more like a study of behavior but in the end if you don't care then why bother argue if its necessary or not.

[johnny]

Because i think it's sadistic. Sorry, can't help how i feel.

[Blind_Prophet]

Originally posted by johnny: Because i think it's sadistic. Sorry, can't help how i feel.

What I don't understand is if you don't care about the fish being killed then where does the sadistic part come into play the people that hit the button just don't care about the fish either mabey they think hey its just a fish fish die everyday what do i care.

[Aerich]

The point is that it did not need to happen, nor would it have happened except for human actions. It is unnecessary, gratuitous, wasteful, and shows no respect for life at all.

I'm not going to cry about a goldfish, but I do think it's sad that someone would push that button and probably have forgotten about it an hour later. I also consider goldfish to be higher life forms than insects (also nicer to look at and much less numerous) [img]smile.gif[/img]

*Note - I've never seen Fear Factor and I tend not to kill bugs. Except mosquitoes. I also live in a cool climate; I'd probably kill more bugs if I lived in places that grow huge roaches (the mobile kind - BC does grow/make roaches of the other sort).