Stupid Unions trying to get actors not to audition for Hobbit films

[Larry_OHF]

http://www.theonering.net/

The title says it all. Read the news on the link.

P. J. has come back with a response to it, by the way.

We'll never see the Hobbit. It's like some increadible force beyond mortal understanding is preventing the film from ever being made. Why? WHY???

[SpiritWarrior]

Bah, I think this, like previous conflicts will be resolved. All involved in The Hobbit know, from the success of the LOTR's, that this movei is a goldmine. Where details conflict, money motivates. A deal will be a reached, a green light lit, and production will start. AFAIK they haven't even got the scripts written anyways.

[Timber Loftis]

You know, you can let the union cut off its nose to spite its face. PJ has shown that his JRR Tolkein franchise movies can take relative unknowns and make them into international stars -- so, methinks he'll be able to get folks to do the job.

[Yorick]

The union is actually good. I'm union. SAG/AFTRA.

In my area, the Aussie union actually sucks. It means an ad can play for 20 or more years with some singer's voice on it, possibly limiting their career by identifying them with a certain product, and yet the singer is sitting on their cool $500 for the session, while the product rakes in millions of sales.

How is that fair?

If you scour the internet for non-Union jobs they're all offering "no pay" but credits! And a meal!

Great... credits to get... more work for credits and meals?

A mate of mine was a host on a reality show that's been playing repeats for the last 5 years. As a non-Union guy on a non-Union show, he only got paid for filming, not residuals. So his face is on the TV, but while the show makes money from repeated showings of his work, he's working as a laborer in a factory unable to take time off to go to auditions.

So please.... the union is a good thing. They get us health insurance (what...? Actors and singers get sick???) they make sure we get fairly compensated. And we're not talking millions. Just something better than credits and a meal.

[Yorick]

Originally Posted by Timber Loftis take relative unknowns and make them into international stars

Yeah yeah, the old entertainment industry myth... Work for free! You'll get famous! So you can get more work for free!

I wonder how typecast Mark Hamill, forever known as Luke Skywalker, and unable to get cast in anything outside of voiceover work, would have felt if it were a non-Union job at the time.

Meaning those three films WERE his 15 minutes of fame, and while Star Wars raked in millions, he got nothing?

Please guys... the Union is a good thing. And thank goodness Mark is able to do Union voiceover work, so a talented guy is able to keep making good work.

[Cerek]

Originally Posted by Yorick Yeah yeah, the old entertainment industry myth... Work for free! You'll get famous! So you can get more work for free! I wonder how typecast Mark Hamill, forever known as Luke Skywalker, and unable to get cast in anything outside of voiceover work, would have felt if it were a non-Union job at the time. Meaning those three films WERE his 15 minutes of fame, and while Star Wars raked in millions, he got nothing? Please guys... the Union is a good thing. And thank goodness Mark is able to do Union voiceover work, so a talented guy is able to keep making good work.

It is what it is. It's true Mark Hamill and Carrie Fisher suffered from typecasting because of the HUGE success of Star Wars, but it also served to launch Harrison Ford's career into the stratosphere.

That's the double-edged sword of fame - if you become TOO famous for something, that's all you're associated with - just ask Ralph Macchio. But I also have to wonder how much of their LACK of follow-up success has to do with their agents.

Jim Carrey, Tom Hanks and Robin Williams were all able to make the major shift from comedy to dramatic roles (with varying success).

As for the unions, they can be very good or very bad for their members. When they back them up and get them better benefits and working conditions, that is a good thing, but when they decide to abuse their power for continued sanctions, that is a bad thing.

The same thing is true in the education field. Some teacher unions do a GREAT job providing their members with support and negotiating power. On the other hand, union reps got the ENTIRE STAFF of high school fired last year because they simply refused to negotiate acceptable terms with the new superintendent (but that's a separate thread).

If the union won't allow members to work on The Hobbit, then I'm sure there are plenty of non-union actors/actresses that will be happy to take their place.

[Timber Loftis]

I'm not trying to say the union shouldn't exist, but from what I can tell it's not legal under NZ's law. Unions can be very good things or very bad things, depending on the circumstances. But what exactly are they asking of PJ here? Do they want him to NOT film in NZ? Because that seems the only solution for them.

[SpiritWarrior]

They can't want him to not film in NZ, especially after all the attention LOTR's brought that country. The revenue from tourism, permits, visas and just bragging rights in general are only a positive for kiwis. I agree though, unions are a good thing in general - I mean, if ONLY all jobs had a union it could prevent much shennanigans that I have seen in the past.

From what I can see, the guilds and unions perceive an unfair treatment of their actors/members, and are instructing said members to decline the roles. Now "must haves" like Ian McKellan and Cate Blanchett are considering declining as per direction of their guild. I hope this doesn't happen. Just give them what they want IMO. Anyways, MGM and New Line released this statement later on according to onering.net

New Line, Warner Bros. Pictures and Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Pictures are concerned by the recent allegations of unfair treatment of actors in New Zealand and instructions from the performers’ guilds to their membership to withhold services from the producers of “The Hobbit” in New Zealand. We are proud to have good relations with all of those performers’ guilds and value their contribution to the motion pictures produced in their respective jurisdictions throughout the world. But we believe that in this case the allegations are baseless and unfair to Peter Jackson and his team in Wellington who have been tireless supporters of the New Zealand motion picture community.

I am in no way versed in the intricacies of this, but it seems to me that when LOTR's was being filmed (all 3 parts!) it was all gravy. Now, that the success of the franchise soars, everyone has an issue. Whether these issues are retroactive idk. Or maybe they are fabricated. Regardless, the companies deny them. I still seem them all coming to an "understanding". People will move misty mountains to green light this cash-cow.

[Yorick]

Originally Posted by Cerek If the union won't allow members to work on The Hobbit, then I'm sure there are plenty of non-union actors/actresses that will be happy to take their place.

So you'd be happy for Gandalf to NOT be played by Ian MacKeller (who is Union). For Elrond NOT to be played by Hugo Weaving (who is also Union).

[Yorick]

Originally Posted by Timber Loftis Do they want him to NOT film in NZ? Because that seems the only solution for them.

The solution would be to pay ALL the actors in the film the same union rate, rather than skimp on the NZ actors, while paying the SAG actors properly. Why should the NZ actors be robbed of what they're due?

Moving the production to Easter Europe is a threat from Jackson to cowtow New Zealanders. But no matter where he moves it, if there's a SAG boycot in support of the NZ actors, there's none of the featured cast from "Lord of the Rings" on board. They're all SAG.