Remember that Dutch comic about Mohamad?

[Stratos]

Originally Posted by Variol (Farseer) Elmwood Yeah, according to news today, they're still on about it. Boy, could you imagine what we Christians would do if we retaliated every time someone took our Saviours' name in vane? ..wouldn't be many people around I think.

Well, the Mohammed cartoons does a little more than just the equivalent of "taking the Lords name in vain."

[Stratos]

Originally Posted by Yorick Fund a mental?

Fund a mental.

[Beaumanoir]

Uhuh, yep, and agreed with everything you say Yorick. (Btw, nice seeing you on here! It's been a while! ) But this is what makes you a good person! I'm not slating any religious people, I think it's great for someone to have something to believe in, I almost envy them. It's just that there are certain people who take things too far in all faiths.

All the violent protests of Muslims are no different, in my oh-so-very-humble opinion, to members of, say, the Westboro Baptist Church. Saying that 'Fags' are evil and going to hell? It's ludicrous. It's all hate-speech against fellow human beings and I'm against it. People need to stop focusing on their differences and start looking at our similarities. We're all the same race, regardless of creed, colour or sexuality; whether or not you believe that a god made us is totally irrelevant.

(Thanks Luvian )

Love you all, regardless!

[Yorick]

Originally Posted by Beaumanoir I almost envy them. It's just that there are certain people who take things too far in all faiths.

Agreed, though I'd call taking things too far "radicalism", while adhering to the core tenets "fundamentalism".

All the violent protests of Muslims are no different, in my oh-so-very-humble opinion, to members of, say, the Westboro Baptist Church. Saying that 'Fags' are evil and going to hell? It's ludicrous.

I agree also, but must point out that Westboro Baptist Church are not affiliated with the Baptist Church, and are an anomaly, whereas it could be argued that a Muslim who interprets Jihad as a physical struggle is employing a fundamentalist interpretation of Islam. "Fundamentalist" is a relative term.

Nowhere in the bible does it give humans the power to decide if a person is going to hell. What it gives those who accept Jesus, is an assurance of where they themselves are going.

It also describes all humans as being unrighteous, rebellious, evil and sinful. Christians, noChristians, Jews, nonJews alike.

If someone who is forgiven by Jesus turns around and decries and punishes another fellow sinner for being evil, they walk into the more dangerous territory of the story of the guy forgiven of a debt of thousands by a king, who turns around and imprisons a man because he owes him a couple of hundred dollars.

That scares me! I don't want to be that guy. I have received so much grace from God. So much forgiveness in my imperfect muddling, that I NEED to treat other people with the same forgiving heart... and this ironically includes me needing to be less judgemental of fire-brand preachers who I think "have it wrong".

Remember the Lord's prayer? "Forgive us our sins as we forgive others".

It's all hate-speech against fellow human beings and I'm against it. People need to stop focusing on their differences and start looking at our similarities. We're all the same race, regardless of creed, colour or sexuality; whether or not you believe that a god made us is totally irrelevant.

Yeah, I agree we're all humans, we all have worldviews and faith that our worldview is more correct than not. But I think what that worldview entails drastically changes how a person behaves, loves and directs their life.

Obviously a muslim who believes martyrdom leads to salvation is going to rush headlong into death more than a person who believes this life is all they will ever have.

Or a person who believes they will live forever after they die, may cling to earthly possessions less strongly. etc etc.

Similarly, a godless evolution theory encouraged the idea that Aboriginal Australians and the Bantu of South Africa were lower down the evolutionary rung. Bantu were hunted in South Africa!! A high court eventually decided they were human!!!

The American idea of equality rests on God bestowing the same rights on all people he made. A Hindu born into the highest Brahman caste is not going to believe that an untouchable Dalit is equal to him. The caste system is built on inequality.

So, how we see the world IS important. Hence discussion so we "compare notes" is also VITAL! You and I agree that all are made equal, despite having different beliefs, and I hope more would ultimately agree.

Love you all, regardless!

Great talking to you too man!!

[Yorick]

Originally Posted by Variol (Farseer) Elmwood Yorick; I love you! You said that so well in the 2 posts. It's about hating the act, never the person. The thing is that we tend to view sin in degrees. "The murderer, the rapist, the pedofile etc are all worse than I am." Not true! God sees all sin as equal. If we can remember that, it makes it a lot easier to bridge those gaps. Well, I'm off to church. Be well my cyber family, I love you all!

You too Variol! Peace my friend.

[Lavindathar]

I love watchin beau post on religious topics, as me and him have got to be the most "non religious" people out there.

But tbh, I agree with my brother for the most part.

But personally, I think we should abolish all forms of religion and outlaw practicing any religion.

The only religion, if you can call it that, that gets anywhere close to being worth while, is Buddhism.

[Yorick]

Originally Posted by Lavindathar But personally, I think we should abolish all forms of religion and outlaw practicing any religion.

Which the Russian and Chinese communist states attempted.
Is that really what you want? A totalitarian state with thought police decreeing what people must believe?

The only religion, if you can call it that, that gets anywhere close to being worth while, is Buddhism.

The irony is that it was the Buddhist faith which the Chinese communists thought so evil, they went to great lengths to purge China of in the cultural revolution.

The Dalai Lama's role as god-king is extremely offensive to the Maoists. Where is the separation of church and state in Lamaist Tibet?

[Chewbacca]

Time to stick our heads in the sand again or did we ever take them out?

IMO I say let the religion moratorium stand. Much better than allowing prostlytizing.

[Lavindathar]

The difference would be Yorick, that if it was outlawed, no-one would be allowed to tell anyone what to believe

And it was only a daft thing to say, as it would never happen. But, I believe so many problems would be solved if some Jew 3000 years ago didn't write a story about a man who could walk on water....

Religion causes more deaths per year than anything else. Including disease. I read that somewhere. Anyway, point being, religious wars etc, that constantly occur, and still do, cause deaths. If people didnt believe in anything, we'd all be friends. Instead we'd be killing people cos they stole our kit-kats.

Obviously people can believe what they want, but I just hate religion for the pure fact impo, its put the world in its current state - a total mess.

[Beaumanoir]

Originally Posted by Lavindathar Religion causes more deaths per year than anything else. Including disease. I read that somewhere.

Haha. Must be true then, eh?

In fairness though, I think what Lav is trying to say is that organisedreligion is the problem, not religion itself. (I think). In which case, to an extent, I agree. I think the world would be a better place without it, yes, but it's here now, and a ban on it would be a total breach of freedom of thought and speech. It'd get like 1984.

Originally Posted by Chewbacca IMO I say let the religion moratorium stand. Much better than allowing prostlytizing.

OH NOES! AN INTERESTING DEBATE ON THE INTERNETZ!!

Come on, mate. Heaven forbid we get an actual lively debate on a topic rather than re-hashed stories from Yahoo's Weird News. (Love you Bung ). Everyone's being civil and I, for one, find it interesting to hear others opinions.