Visit the Ironworks Gaming Website Email the Webmaster Graphics Library Rules and Regulations Help Support Ironworks Forum with a Donation to Keep us Online - We rely totally on Donations from members Donation goal Meter

Ironworks Gaming Radio

Ironworks Gaming Forum

Go Back   Ironworks Gaming Forum > Ironworks Gaming Forums > General Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-21-2009, 09:04 PM   #81
Felix The Assassin
The Dreadnoks
 

Join Date: September 27, 2001
Location: Orlando, FL
Age: 61
Posts: 3,608
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritWarrior View Post
That's what they fall back on when you complain. But then, why have I website that claims to do the tracking for you, when it doesn't. I have no problem scrawling on a tablet or on a notepad, but why even have online banking if it isn't accurate?
Because their records are accurate, how else did you get that over draft fee? In comparison, *my* credit card payment was due today @ 1700 Hrs EST. My on-line money account has the payment amount in a "processed" state, yet @ my cc activity page, it's "processing". Thereby I have lost 7 hours of interest potential, yet they have gained 7 hours of interest earnings, but will not disclose the transaction complete until 0230 Hrs EST 22DEC09.

Any institution that is in business to make a profit, will MAKE A PROFIT, even at the expense of a federal government mishap. Especially if thay are voting at 0100 Hrs.
__________________
The Lizzie Palmer Tribute



Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.

John F. Kennedy
35th President of The United States

The Last Shot

Honor The Fallen

Jesus died for our sins, and American Soldiers died for our freedom.




If you don't stand behind our Soldiers, please feel free to stand in front of them.
Felix The Assassin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 08:03 AM   #82
Morgeruat
Jack Burton
 

Join Date: October 16, 2001
Location: PA
Age: 43
Posts: 5,421
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritWarrior View Post
Like I said before, would it matter now? The difference between you and I is, I watch the work and make my mind up. Here, you did the reverse. Why would viewing the movie change the mind of someone who made it up before seeing it?
I guess you missed the part where Cerek watched Bowling for Columbine and had his stance on the movie significantly softened (while still standing by the well established proof of a stream of inaccuracies).
__________________
"Any attempt to cheat, especially with my wife, who is a dirty, dirty, tramp, and I am just gonna snap." Knibb High Principal - Billy Madison
Morgeruat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 08:16 AM   #83
Morgeruat
Jack Burton
 

Join Date: October 16, 2001
Location: PA
Age: 43
Posts: 5,421
Interested Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritWarrior View Post
If he was so confident in this person and her PoV, why was she not named as the author? Not even a quote box and the original title and copywright were omitted. Bit shady if you ask me.
Generally before I post anything by her I scrub it, and if you check the original articles (the liberal lies about healthcare series) it's apparent where irrelevant or hateful speech has been removed. *shrugs* I got lazy at the end and was in a hurry, so sue me. Simple exercise, scrub out the "hateful speech" (just like I scrub any number of right-wing commentators to remove republican only bias, and well, Al makes up stats, like the interview where he said the earth's core was severall million degrees... the surface of the sun is only about 12,000... (the corona is much much hotter, but still only averages 2 Million), or in his film where he shows florida sinking under twenty seven feet of increased sea-level... best guesses are about 7 inches by pro-cc scientists, absolute worst case scenario in a couple thousand years, it might get to 27' of water. Not accurate within our greatgreatgreatgreatgreat grandchildren's lifetime. But yeah, I've found Democrats tend to "create" the "truth" wholecloth, or choose to spend a week reporting on a boy who wasn't in a balloon when real issues are cropping up all over the place, replacing news with frivolity.

And people wonder why cnn's got the lowest ratings of any cable news channel, and they were the first... And Faux News' ratings continue to soar... http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/bu...7cnn.html?_r=1

Anyway, to get back to the question, I didn't source because, like I said a few posts ago, regardless of facts and sourced data, people like you will reject it because you don't like the person saying it. Removing the polarizing person from the equation forces you to look at relatively neutral facts.
__________________
"Any attempt to cheat, especially with my wife, who is a dirty, dirty, tramp, and I am just gonna snap." Knibb High Principal - Billy Madison

Last edited by Morgeruat; 12-22-2009 at 09:42 AM.
Morgeruat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 10:15 AM   #84
Cerek
Registered Member
Iron Throne Cult
 

Join Date: August 27, 2004
Location: North Carolina
Age: 61
Posts: 4,888
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritWarrior View Post
Yes, it would be empty. You were stoically against it a year ago, and let's face it, only with much prodding and calling out, did you even come to consider watching said movie. And you still have not. It's cool, I mean, I am just pointing out the differences. I read Ann and Rush's books before I started criticizing them. A criticism that you share with me. So they must be doing something wrong. But like I said, that is the difference between us. As for finding the movie, try libraries, mine has it there. Or email Al Gore and ask for a free copy - he gives them away for free.
At least you admit it will be an empty exercise. When I've mentioned the film in the past, you've said I'm not qualified to speak on it because I've not watched the movie and now you're admitting you'll still make that claim after I watch it. I appreciate you being honest about that.

As for the differences between us, you've decided to dismiss anything Rush or Coulter have to say based on their previous works and history. My skepticism of Gore's film was based on the same thing; his past actions which have been shown to either be hypocritical (lower your carbon footprint) or self-serving (buy carbon offsets from this company I own). The fact that his film was proven to contain numerous errors and outright lies just serves to confirm my skepticism. Despite all of that, though, I'm still willing to watch the film to see what valid points he may have.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritWarrior View Post
Comparing "Global Warming" to political pundent bias is apples and oranges IMO. This is not some left-wing theory he thought up. Yet much of what Coulter and Rush think up are right-wing theories or doctrines. In a nutshell, this is bigger than partisanship - yet for some reason (which I can only attribute to oil and lobbying), the USA has made it this way.
Global Warming or GCC has become one of the central political issues facing our country and others. Since Gore is a politician and not a scientist, I don't see much difference between his bias and the bias of other political pundits. Also, according to you and SecretMaster, the fact that Gore is not a scientist at all (let alone an environmental scientist), should automatically disqualify from speaking on the topic of GCC/GW.

But, as you said, it's all cool. You and SM accept Gore's efforts because you agree with much of what he says. I agreed that Coulter and Limbaugh use too much hate rhetoric, but I still agree with many of the points they make (once the rhetoric is filtered out).

See, we're really not so different after all.
__________________
Cerek the Calmth
Cerek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 02:55 PM   #85
SpiritWarrior
Jack Burton
 

Join Date: May 31, 2002
Location: Ireland
Posts: 5,854
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerek View Post
At least you admit it will be an empty exercise. When I've mentioned the film in the past, you've said I'm not qualified to speak on it because I've not watched the movie and now you're admitting you'll still make that claim after I watch it. I appreciate you being honest about that.

Why are you acting like this is the first time i've said this? I have done so around three times. I have links to prove it. But let me spell it out for you again. Pointless, because you evaluated a movie before you ever saw it. Now, by all means watch it if you like, but I don't expect your opinion to change. You demonstrated that you make judgements based on third-party facts, or to use your term, "one side" of the story, without giving the actual case in question, a second look. I am guessing that this simply doesn't sit well with you personally, and so you're trying to make it a wash by denying it or something? Either ways I don't care.

Quote:
As for the differences between us, you've decided to dismiss anything Rush or Coulter have to say based on their previous works and history. My skepticism of Gore's film was based on the same thing; his past actions which have been shown to either be hypocritical (lower your carbon footprint) or self-serving (buy carbon offsets from this company I own). The fact that his film was proven to contain numerous errors and outright lies just serves to confirm my skepticism. Despite all of that, though, I'm still willing to watch the film to see what valid points he may have.
Based on his books that you've read? His movies you've seen? His articles you have gone through? The papers you've studied? The nobel peace prize that he won? No, this is a political thing with you, i'm thinking.
You listed 3 reasons there, all of which are related to this movie you haven't seen. You have done no research of your own - why do you expect credibility here?

He's not a polarizing figure who goes on TV every two weeks, says something ourtrageous, and gets more attention. He's not a political commentator. Both Rushie and Coulter are. What'd someone call them before...the wages of hate?
__________________
Still I feel like a child when I look at the moon, maybe I grew up a little too soon...
SpiritWarrior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 03:00 PM   #86
SpiritWarrior
Jack Burton
 

Join Date: May 31, 2002
Location: Ireland
Posts: 5,854
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgeruat View Post
I guess you missed the part where Cerek watched Bowling for Columbine and had his stance on the movie significantly softened (while still standing by the well established proof of a stream of inaccuracies).
No, i've heard this before (we've been down this road more than once). It's a bit of a red herring. If you already know your stance can be "significantly softened", wouldn't you, from then on, make it your personal business to view these movies beforehand? This requires action on his part, not on any of ours. It is not enough to say "Oh well I did actually change my mind after someone dropped a movie in my lap". Go out and track the movie down yourself. If you're not motivated to do so, then it can't mean all that much to you in the first place. *shrug*
__________________
Still I feel like a child when I look at the moon, maybe I grew up a little too soon...
SpiritWarrior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 03:02 PM   #87
SpiritWarrior
Jack Burton
 

Join Date: May 31, 2002
Location: Ireland
Posts: 5,854
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgeruat View Post
Generally before I post anything by her I scrub it, and if you check the original articles (the liberal lies about healthcare series) it's apparent where irrelevant or hateful speech has been removed. *shrugs* I got lazy at the end and was in a hurry, so sue me. Simple exercise, scrub out the "hateful speech" (just like I scrub any number of right-wing commentators to remove republican only bias, and well, Al makes up stats, like the interview where he said the earth's core was severall million degrees... the surface of the sun is only about 12,000... (the corona is much much hotter, but still only averages 2 Million), or in his film where he shows florida sinking under twenty seven feet of increased sea-level... best guesses are about 7 inches by pro-cc scientists, absolute worst case scenario in a couple thousand years, it might get to 27' of water. Not accurate within our greatgreatgreatgreatgreat grandchildren's lifetime. But yeah, I've found Democrats tend to "create" the "truth" wholecloth, or choose to spend a week reporting on a boy who wasn't in a balloon when real issues are cropping up all over the place, replacing news with frivolity.

And people wonder why cnn's got the lowest ratings of any cable news channel, and they were the first... And Faux News' ratings continue to soar... http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/bu...7cnn.html?_r=1

Anyway, to get back to the question, I didn't source because, like I said a few posts ago, regardless of facts and sourced data, people like you will reject it because you don't like the person saying it. Removing the polarizing person from the equation forces you to look at relatively neutral facts.
Leaving out your source makes it immediately look suspect. And I can't say I agree with editing articles to make them look less polarizing.
__________________
Still I feel like a child when I look at the moon, maybe I grew up a little too soon...
SpiritWarrior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 04:00 PM   #88
Cerek
Registered Member
Iron Throne Cult
 

Join Date: August 27, 2004
Location: North Carolina
Age: 61
Posts: 4,888
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpiritWarrior View Post
Why are you acting like this is the first time i've said this? I have done so around three times. I have links to prove it. But let me spell it out for you again. Pointless, because you evaluated a movie before you ever saw it. Now, by all means watch it if you like, but I don't expect your opinion to change. You demonstrated that you make judgements based on third-party facts, or to use your term, "one side" of the story, without giving the actual case in question, a second look. I am guessing that this simply doesn't sit well with you personally, and so you're trying to make it a wash by denying it or something? Either ways I don't care.



Based on his books that you've read? His movies you've seen? His articles you have gone through? The papers you've studied? The nobel peace prize that he won? No, this is a political thing with you, i'm thinking.
You listed 3 reasons there, all of which are related to this movie you haven't seen. You have done no research of your own - why do you expect credibility here?

He's not a polarizing figure who goes on TV every two weeks, says something ourtrageous, and gets more attention. He's not a political commentator. Both Rushie and Coulter are. What'd someone call them before...the wages of hate?
*sigh* Whatever. I try to respect your opinion, but I really don't care if I have credibility in your eyes or not. When I agree to meet your terms, you admit it won't make any difference, which means it was never a real issue to begin with.
__________________
Cerek the Calmth
Cerek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 04:12 PM   #89
SpiritWarrior
Jack Burton
 

Join Date: May 31, 2002
Location: Ireland
Posts: 5,854
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerek View Post
*sigh* Whatever. I try to respect your opinion, but I really don't care if I have credibility in your eyes or not. When I agree to meet your terms, you admit it won't make any difference, which means it was never a real issue to begin with.
In *my* personal view, it wouldn't make any difference. See, you get yourself into a paradox with things like this for the sole reason that you spoke before you saw. For example, if you saw the movie, and still felt the same I could say "What a shocker. Why am I not surprised?". But if you saw it and did a complete 360 on it, lauding it as a movie to remember, with much depth and a clear message, then you'd appear hypocrital because you'd been saying the opposite all this time, and would lose even MORE credibility. So, this is why I say, for me, it would be pointless. Now for you personally, I would still recommend it, but certainly you've muddied the waters as far as opinion goes and I would have to discount your review regardless of which way it went. This is not rocket science, I know you see my reasoning, regardless of whether you like it or not. Let's move on?
__________________
Still I feel like a child when I look at the moon, maybe I grew up a little too soon...
SpiritWarrior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2009, 06:54 PM   #90
robertthebard
Xanathar Thieves Guild
 

Join Date: March 17, 2001
Location: Wichita, KS USA
Age: 60
Posts: 4,537
Default Re: Single-payer health care plan dies in Senate

Pssst, if he did a 360, he'd come right back to the view he has now.
__________________
To those we have lost; May your spirits fly free.
Good Music: Here.
Interesting read, one of my blogs.
robertthebard is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Three Reasons Why Government Can't Run Health Care Felix The Assassin General Discussion 11 08-31-2009 09:25 PM
Home Health Care Lord of Alcohol General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) 10 06-14-2003 11:09 AM
Universal Health Care in the U.K. MagiK General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) 10 06-03-2003 08:07 PM
Free health care for Iraq but not US? Rokenn General Discussion 11 04-22-2003 11:11 AM
Health care Conan General Conversation Archives (11/2000 - 01/2005) 26 06-22-2001 09:22 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
©2024 Ironworks Gaming & ©2024 The Great Escape Studios TM - All Rights Reserved