project image vs. simurcularcum

[Voltrath]

I've heard that project image is better. Can someone tell me why? From what I know the two spells are the same except for that you can move around and cast spells with simurcularcum, which you cannot with project image. So how is it really?

p.s: did i spell simurcularcum right? (the white 8level mage spell that makes copy of you)

[Dace De'Briago]

Simulcrum produces a clone at approx 60% of the casters level, which reduces the number of spells he is able to cast, as well as his fighting ability.

You can cast restoration on a simulcrum to restore the lost levels.

However, project image allows you to a) circumvent the summons limit and b) cast all spells at no 'cost' to you while the original character is uninjured...

So if you hide your character away somewhere sensible and/or make him invisible...

[LennonCook]

Originally posted by Dace De'Briago: Simulcrum produces a clone at approx 60% of the casters level, which reduces the number of spells he is able to cast, as well as his fighting ability. You can cast restoration on a simulcrum to restore the lost levels.

But *NOT* lost spells. Look around this place, there's a thread there somewhere that explains why.

[Alson]

Neither of them is superior to the other - they're just different.

A general overview....

Project Image and Simulacrum in General:

• Both have their own set of spells, so they're a great way of conserving spells and/or multiplying your spells arsenal. Neither can enjoy the benefits of Contingencies and/or Spell Sequencers type spells.
• Both can use their own copies of the caster's items. Duplicate the Pro-Magic scrolls for some cheese fiesta, use your precious Time Stop scrolls without actually wasting them, conjure Summons that will last sooo much longer than the clones who summoned them, etc, etc. This is perhaps the most powerful aspect of the Clone spells, due to the fact the many one-use items are immensely powerful.
• Both ignore the summoning limit of 5. A clone can raise armies of fodder in less than a turn using their own copies of the Wand of Monster Summoning. In additions, they also ignore the traps limit of 7. Carpet monster lairs with traps this way.

Now, to the specifics...

Project Image:

• The better spellcaster out of the two clones spells. It will hold the original caster (so don't cast one during Time Stop), but the clone has *everything* the original caster had - items and spells.
• The Image will vanish if the original caster takes any damage.
• The Image is vulnerable to both [Dispel, Remove] Magic and True Sight. Thus, casting the appropriate Spell Immunities (Abjuration and Divination, respectively) is a mandatory tactic after the Image is created.
• Casting Project Image causes to the caster to count as Helpless (due to the Hold effect). This leads to the over-the-top-powerful tactic of placing 3 Images in a Chain Contingency, and casting Project Image. Voila! 4 Images, the ultimate BG2 firepower army.
• Shapechanged Images can attack. Bash thy's enemies with Iron Golems!

Simulacrum:

• Not such a good spellcaster as Project Image, but it won't hold the caster.
• Simulacrum isn't dispellable by any means, nor will it vanish if the caster takes any damage. It's rock solid!
• A Simulacrum is implemented as a level drained clone. Its level is not 60% of the caster's, but is determined as follows:
  --Single-classed mages: Original caster's level - (caster's level / 2)
  --Multiclassed mages: Original caster's level - (caster's level / 2) for each class
  --Dual classed mages: Original caster's level - (caster's total levels / 4)
  
  Rounding is unclear for multiclassed mages, sometimes up, sometimes down. Dual classed mages have a clear advantage here. The bigger the difference between their classes, the less levels the clone loses.
• Due to the way the Simulacrum's level is determined, "second generation" clones are level drained less than their creators. A Simulacrum has a lower level than the original caster, so it imposes less level drain on subsequent Simulacrums. Example: A level 32 wizard (you need an XP Cap remover to get this far) produces a level (32 - 32 / 2) 16 Simulacrum. That Simulacrum would produce a level (32 - 16 / 2) 24 Simulacrum. Later generation clones still inherit their caster's more limited selection of spells and abilities, if any.
• Simulacra of people with warrior levels (created by Fighter/Mages or warriors using Vhailor's Helm) become much more effective after someone casts Lesser Restoration on them to restore their "lost" levels.

That's about it. [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Vedran]

Simulacrum.

[Xen]

Project Image

[Assassin]

When this spell is cast, an area roughly 70 feet in radius around the caster will be effected. Instantly and once each round for 1 turn after this spell is cast, all hostile illusion/phantasm spells in the area of effect will be dispelled. The spells that are affected by this are: Reflected Image, Invisibility, Mirror Image, Non-detection, Improved Invisibility, Shadow Door, Mislead, Project Image, and Simulacrum . The area of effect is roughly a 70' radius around the caster. The target's magic resistance, if any, does not come into effect with this spell. This spell only affects enemies, thus it is unable to dispel the invisibility from a party member.

True Sight is supposed to dispel Simalucrum. And, I like Project Image better. Don't know why, but it doesn't interfere with my 8th level spell slots (reserved for 1 Spell Trigger and the rest ADHW), and it's a level lower.

[Dundee Slaytern]

Just to clarify, what Alson meant was that Simulacrum is not affected by Dispel Magic or Remove Magic. True Sight will still get rid of it.

[Assassin]

Simulacrum isn't dispellable by any means, nor will it vanish if the caster takes any damage. It's rock solid!

I took it as it can not be dispellable by anything, including True Sight. I may be wrong, however. Check out this as well: http://members.chello.nl/~j.vanthull/BG2SR/Main.htm Go to the Illusion Overview. It demonstrates that True Sight will not dispel it. Also, while using the spell against the Kangaxx Guardians (they will cast Simulacrum), the Simulacrums were unaffected.

[ 05-07-2003, 12:25 AM: Message edited by: Assassin ]

[Dundee Slaytern]

Hmmmm? Was I witnessing Mislead clones then? Or maybe they were Project Image clones... If the Spell References says they are not affected by True Sight, then I guess I will have to trust them on this one.

By the way, the direct link is this one, Click Here.

ADD] Although if I want to be a pendant, Death Spell will definitely kill any clones. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[ 05-07-2003, 03:11 AM: Message edited by: Dundee Slaytern ]