More random thoughts on the priest-heavy party

[Aerich]

Thought I'd start another thread on the same topic, but a bit more theoretical, so people have plenty of room and scope to get their 2 cents in. Feel free to discuss any aspects that pique your interest.

Here's the current status of the party (in Dragon's Eye).

1) Dwarven Fighter/Cleric [8/8] - main tank. Has been hurt a lot, and usually casts spells before engaging in combat, but not during.

2) Human Evil Cleric [9] will dual to Necromancer at lvl 13 or so - secondary tank. Not as effective an offensive caster as I'd hoped, but a good all-round character. Used for protections, undead summons, healing, party/enemy-affecting spells and Magical Stone.

3) Half-elf Fighter/Druid [8/10] - decent melee/missile fighter to finish off weakened enemies, but much more valuable as a spellcaster. Great for setting up battles with spells and summons, and an effective spellcaster *in* battle to whittle down the opponents.

4) Human Druid [12] - See #3. Also shapechanges a fair bit to tank or decoy.

5) Half-elf Fighter/Mage [8/9] - Insanely valuable. The only party member who can cast mage spells and use bows. Web, Identify, and Fireball. 'Nuff said.

6) Human dual-class Thief/Cleric [11/6] - Good support character, and getting better. Will be Mr Versatile once he hits cleric lvl 12.

[Roboghost]

"Dwarven Fighter/Cleric [8/8] - main tank. Has been hurt a lot, and usually casts spells before engaging in combat, but not during."

--cast Draw Upon Holy Might DURING combat when you can.

"Evil Cleric [9] will dual to Necromancer at lvl 13 or so - secondary tank. Not as effective an offensive caster as I'd hoped, but a good all-round character. Used for protections, undead summons, healing"

--I think Evil Clerics aren't worth it due to most of the best evil spells involve touch. Since the best use of a Necromancer involves touch as well, create a Fighter/Necromancer [not having Illusion hurts, so must replace with armor.]

Clerics are for healing/buffing only--I use mine for the Charisma person too: I can get to 25 Charisma with a certain amulet/helmet/armor combo.

...and...Can you dual to create a Cleric/Necromancer??? Doubt it. Cleric/Mage or Cleric/Illusionist I think.

Having a "Fighter/Druid" AND a "Druid" is kind of redundant--probably best to either have a:
Fighter [can you say, 'Throwing Axe'] plus Druid
OR
Fighter/Druid plus a Bard or Cleric/Ranger
(someone to compliment/help the Fighter/Druid out during battles).

--Oh well...lunch is over now. Back to the grind.

[Aerich]

Here's my general observations:

1) Limited weapon selection - doesn't bother me much. I'm selling off swords as fast as I find them. The F/M has specialization in Axes and Great Swords, so he's carrying the Defender +2 right now. Doesn't use it much.

I bought the Lucky Scimitar (F/D) and the Giving Star (evil Cleric) from Conlan, and every character except the pure Druid has a melee weapon of +2 or better. I use Moonblade and Flameblade against certain enemies (undead; trolls).

Where limited selection hurts is with missile weapons. Only one bow-enabled character significantly reduces the damage you can cause with ranged weapons, and a lot of cool crossbows and longbows will have to be sold. OTOH, the prevalence of spells does a lot to counter the disadvantage.

2) Scouting/thievery - not amazing. I've been through the game a few times, so I know what's coming. This party isn't really built for ambush, it's built for decoy/tank tactics. Spells (Find Traps, Mirror Image, Knock, and healing) take up the slack until the T/C dual class regains thief skills.

3) General combat - this party is all about strategy and preparation, especially on insane. It's not tough enough or good enough with weapons to bull through enemies, but battlefield preparation and summoning spells allowed me to walk through some tough fights with nary a scratch. Small fights can actually result in more damage, as I'm less willing to use damaging or movement inhibiting spells.

Spellcasters can be tough, especially mages, if they manage to avoid Webs and Spike Growth. A mere one bow + relatively long casting times for priest spells allows enemy mages to get more spells off without disruption.

[Aerich]

Well, (in response to Roboghost's post) this party wasn't meant to be balanced, it was meant to let me experiment with as many priest spells as possible. Otherwise, yes, I would have a better mix of warriors and mages.

I do cast DUHM right before I move forward to engage. Sometimes I also spend a 2nd lvl mage slot on Strength, to bring the F/C up to 18/00 before I cast DUHM.

I would agree that evil clerics aren't really worth it, but I wanted to try. Loss of higher healing/raising spells is not compensated for by sub-par or difficult-to-use offensive spells.

I use the pure Druid (18 Cha) for my buying needs.

You can dual to Cleric/Necromancer in IWD (I checked). I'd never played one, and it seemed like a good roleplaying combination, so I'll keep it. With the Cleric's undead summons, glyphs, Cloud of Pestilence, etc weakening the opposition and providing a distraction, I should be able to use the necromancer to cause some serious damage, once it gets going.

And if you've never tried out having two druids before, give it a shot! They really do have amazing spells that hinder, weaken or just plain damage the enemy, and some of the combinations you can come up with are deadly. For example, you can divide the summoning, hindering, healing and attack spells. One spends its 3rd lvl slots on Spike Growth, the other spends them on Mold Touch. The first one spends 4th lvl slots on summons, and the second on Smashing Wave, Static Charge, or Produce Fire. Cast Spike Growth, then summons, Mold Touch them and send them forward to devastate the enemy, and then finish it off with area-effect spells.

If druids aren't handicapped by having to spend all their slots on healing/protective spells, they give mages a run for their money in terms of offensive ability and versatility. Also, their summons are better, especially in the mid-game.

[dragonslayer]

wouldn't a paladin go into an all cleric party, he has priest spells after all

[Neo the Warrior Cat]

He doesn't have enough slots and has late access to spells. A too little too late situation.

[NobleNick]

dragonslayer and Neo the Warrior Cat,
~
(Slight spoiler ahead)
~
~

Yes, I would classify a Pally as Priest-related.

Three very redeeming characteristics to remember about the Paladin:

1.) He has high saving throws. So, while your beefy fighters are in a trancelike state, slobbering on the floor or, worse yet, attacking each other, the Pally is slicing away at the enemy spellcaster.

2.) (spoiler) In Lower Dorn's Deep there is an unbelievable Paladin-only kick-assassin longsword that makes the Pally connect and do damage about as good as the best of Fighters.

3.) Though a so-so character in the beginning ("Why didn't I pick a Fighter, instead?"); as the game progresses (and on harder difficulties) the benefits of the Pally become more apparent. His high saving throws combined with the ability to wear the best of armor make him the choice pick for constructing the most durable tank: The best tank in the late game is a Paladin; and this should be your only choice if your party only has one tank; especially if you are doing the expansions and/or HoF mode.

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What's a party,
without a song?
Bards ROCK!
Party On!!