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Old 05-30-2001, 02:00 PM   #1
IamGeorge
Elite Waterdeep Guard
 

Join Date: March 15, 2001
Location: New Orleans, Louisiana, USA
Posts: 20
I hear a lot of people saying that a Kensai/Thief dual is good, but wouldnt you have to want your thief to be a melee fighter? What weapon should he use? Short Sword? And would you put 5 points into it or what?
If I wanted my thief to use a short bow, would i have to make it a fighter with no kits to dual (no wizard slayer)? Is there anything I have to look out for before I assign proficiency points? I dont want to waste them or put them in the wrong thing.
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Old 05-30-2001, 02:13 PM   #2
Accord
Ninja Storm Shadow
 

Join Date: March 1, 2001
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 3,537
Contain minor SPOILER regarding items:
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I would not recommend short sword....instead, I highly recommend the katana (Celestial Fury) and the long sword (Blade of Rose, Daystar, Flame Tongue) if you intend to dual from kensai to thief (also 2-weapon style). However, if you have any EXTRA slots left and don't know where to put, I advice you to put into hammers (due to Crom Faeyr) which you can put on your off hand for dual wielding.
As for where to put the points, try to focus on one weapon while you are still leveling up as kensai, as your weapon of choice will be restricted to theif's when you dual class (and the kensai's original points will be disappeared, but don't worry, once the dual class is completed you will get them back, but I don't think they are cumulative from both classes), once your thief's level is at least 1 more than kensai's, you will get to put weapon points into weapon that are available for kensai too.

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Old 05-30-2001, 04:51 PM   #3
IamGeorge
Elite Waterdeep Guard
 

Join Date: March 15, 2001
Location: New Orleans, Louisiana, USA
Posts: 20
Wouldnt it be better to pick one weapon and dual 2 of those than to dual 2 different weapons? You can focus more points on it. Which is better to dual, long swords or katanas?
I am also probably going to dual as soon as the game starts because I plan of having an entire full team of created charaters, after I beat the game normally. I will need a thief early on and I cant wait to level up the fighter. Is this gonna cause any problems?
Also, what weapons can my fighter and theif both use?

Thanks for the reply, Accord.
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Old 05-30-2001, 07:11 PM   #4
Epona
Zartan
 

Join Date: March 1, 2001
Location: London, England
Age: 52
Posts: 5,164
Quote:
Originally posted by IamGeorge:
I will need a thief early on and I cant wait to level up the fighter. Is this gonna cause any problems?
Also, what weapons can my fighter and theif both use?

Thanks for the reply, Accord.
This shouldn't cause any problems. I have dualled my Kensai to a thief at level 9, and you start the game at about level 7. So you have 1 less weapon point at level 7 than I did, your THAC0 will be slightly higher and your AC will be slightly higher (if you dual from Kensai). This shouldn't cause you any problems.

Dual class Kensai/Thief will be able to use any weapon that a Kensai can use, once the Kensai class becomes active. However when Kensai is inactive, you can only put points in weapons that a thief can use, and they will not be accumulative with the points you gave the Kensai. Once the Kensai becomes active, you can then start to add more points to your original Kensai choice weapons! (Complicated, bear with me...)
So when you are allocating weapons points while you are a thief, use them for something different.

For example. You start off with a Kensai. You put 5 points in longsword, and 1 in dual wield.
Then you dual to a thief, and immediately get 2 points to allocate. Putting anything else in dual wield would waste the point, so put them in katana and club (or shortbow if you don't intend to dual wield and have dualled from a fighter who can use ranged weapons.) Carry on allocating your weapon points in this way when you level up. Don't dual wield while your Kensai class is inactive, your THAC0 will be too high.
When you get to level 8, your Kensai(Fighter) class will become active again. Now you can go back to dual wielding. Next time you get a weapons point when you level, you can put it in any weapon, so put another in dual wield, katana, (shortbow if not a Kensai), or a blunt weapon so you can do something about those clay golems, whatever is most use to you.
Also the Kensai/Thief can wear shadow armour - very useful indeed. This character is a very effective melee fighter - slice & dice!

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Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so.

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[This message has been edited by Epona (edited 05-30-2001).]
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Old 05-30-2001, 07:18 PM   #5
Accord
Ninja Storm Shadow
 

Join Date: March 1, 2001
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 3,537
Quote:
Originally posted by IamGeorge:
Wouldnt it be better to pick one weapon and dual 2 of those than to dual 2 different weapons? You can focus more points on it. Which is better to dual, long swords or katanas?
I am also probably going to dual as soon as the game starts because I plan of having an entire full team of created charaters, after I beat the game normally. I will need a thief early on and I cant wait to level up the fighter. Is this gonna cause any problems?
Also, what weapons can my fighter and theif both use?

Thanks for the reply, Accord.
No problem.
As Epona stated, ther shouldn't be any problem. But don't forget kensai's bonus "kai" is given to you every 4 levels. And the extra proficiency point might make it worth while to dual at lvl 9. Remember, thieves/bards level up the fastest of all classes, they only need 160,000 exp point to reach lvl 10.



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Old 05-30-2001, 08:40 PM   #6
Robin, Thief of Hearts
The Magister
 

Join Date: April 8, 2001
Location: Caribbean
Posts: 144
I spent a lot of time experimenting with dual classed thief and fighter classes. Here are some tips that might be useful-

Going from Thief to Fighter:
Disadvantages are lower hit points, and limited ability as a thief( you'll dual at level 9-10 right?) so you end up with a weaker fighter and a less effective thief.
Advantages are you get to pick a thief kit if you especially like any of them.
Going with a Swashbuckler might not be the best choice- you lose backstabbing.
If you take Assassin, the limited skill points available make the character very ineffective as a good thief, and you lose the higher backstab bonuses that would come later in the Assassin career. Trying Bounty Hunter may be a good choice.

Going from Fighter to Thief:
--This works much better. You get a lot of Hit points, and the Thief levels up fast, so you actually dual earlier on. As a plain Thief( kitless) you get the max number of skill points to use. And, the Kit choices for Fighter are available, including Kensai, and Berserker.
Since you cannot use heavy armour to stealth about, you might as well pick the Kensai. (My Kensai-thief cannot wear the Shadow Armour. Might be a bug? I dunno.)
Kai ability plus backstab is a hefty weapon! If you allocate a point or two into axes, or even daggers, you can get the useful ability to throw weapons as a missile, (something the Kensai cannot do with bows.)Ranged attacks are VERY useful. I like daggers meself for RP, but there's only the AI to see it, so what's the point? Take axes.

When a thief, you can put stars into weapon styles - dual weapon is good. If you place a single star in the single weapon category, it allows you to wield just one weapon, and get a little bonus in the AC, but this can just as easily come with a buckler. So, put it in Sword & Shield instead. Makes you flexible.

NEVER make the mistake of putting stars in the SAME weapon class when you dual class, as they will be lost forever when you get your first class back. They don't accumulate!
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Old 05-30-2001, 11:09 PM   #7
IamGeorge
Elite Waterdeep Guard
 

Join Date: March 15, 2001
Location: New Orleans, Louisiana, USA
Posts: 20
Thanks.
I would like to wait till lvl 9 to dual, but i wouldnt have a thief while the fighter is leveling up and while the thief is getting to level 10. I am gonna have a full team of created characters, and this will be my only thief. Do i need thief skills this early? I cant remember if i need to unlock a chest with something in the bedroom in the dungeon. This could be a big dilemma.
Also, which weapons do u think would be the best dual wield? I am gonna have a ranger/cleric dual a hammer and something. I was thinking the thief could dual long sword/scimitar or long sowrd/ katana. How does that sound?
Also, what weapons can backstab? I dont use backstab in my current game because Jan is not that good at hiding in shadows. I would like to take advantage of it.

[This message has been edited by IamGeorge (edited 05-31-2001).]
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Old 05-31-2001, 05:02 AM   #8
sunder
Zhentarim Guard
 

Join Date: May 29, 2001
Location: harwood, md.
Posts: 381
If you don't have another character with longswords as their major weapon, I would go with that. there are ALOT of different and powerful longswords in the game, and I believe there is only 1 Great Katana in the game, Celestial Fury.
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