Buying music on a CD?? Be warned!! >:(

[Sir Krustin]

I just read an article that pretty much nails my opinion of copy protection versus online piracy right on the head, well worth reading!

Free Library Home Page

[ 11-14-2002, 10:56 PM: Message edited by: Sir Krustin ]

[The Cavalier]

Can somebody please tell me where to find an agent that both downloads AND plays music? Like Napster used to?!? I keep downloading things that do only one or the other!!!

[Leonis]

Originally posted by Sir Krustin: I just read an article that pretty much nails my opinion of copy protection versus online piracy right on the head, well worth reading! Free Library Home Page

Good article, but you have to take into account that book reading online has only a small fraction of the usership that music online does.
Also to the best of my knowledge, countries like China aren't mass producing illegal copies of English language texts...

[Leonis]

Originally posted by The Cavalier: Can somebody please tell me where to find an agent that both downloads AND plays music? Like Napster used to?!? I keep downloading things that do only one or the other!!!

The Cavalier, many of these programs possibly contravene the TOS (see Rules and Regulations link at top of pages) therefore people may be reticent to share this information here.

Downloading copyrighted music without payment or permission is still illegal hence some of the debate here.

If you know something audio/software etc is definately free but can't find it, I'd suggest Kazaa

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Leonis: quote: Originally posted by Sir Krustin: I just read an article that pretty much nails my opinion of copy protection versus online piracy right on the head, well worth reading! Free Library Home Page

Good article, but you have to take into account that book reading online has only a small fraction of the usership that music online does.
Also to the best of my knowledge, countries like China aren't mass producing illegal copies of English language texts...[/QUOTE]THe other thing is, with Book reading online, you aren't injecting the medium into you in the same manner as you would with a book, You're tied to your computer screen. You don't actually HAVE the book.

With a copied CD, you DO have the medium. There is no difference between listening to a pirated CD to an authentic one.

This is why tapes were never such a big deal. A copied tape lost quality. Tapes didn't sound the same as records anyway. It was a reduced experience. With CDs, the copying is near instantaneous, the quality to human ears unaffected. It's a bigger deal.

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Leonis: Downloading copyrighted music without payment or permission is still illegal hence some of the debate here.

Illegal and immoral.

It's interesting to note, that you and I are to my knowledge the ONLY professional musicians on this board, let alone this debate, yet we're the only ones arguing against the theft of our property.

To any of you guys arguing against, could you take a moment, and imagine if people were using your services, or taking your property without permission?

Now, just say that people were here arguing that people SHOULD be allowed to rip off a carpenter. Not pay him for building their house if they don't feel like it.

They SHOULD be able to hire ten people at your job to do your work with you, and only pay the people they feel do a job they like, no matter whether they keep the result of your unpaid labours or not.

[ 11-15-2002, 08:29 AM: Message edited by: Yorick ]

[Yorick]

Originally posted by The Cavalier: Can somebody please tell me where to find an agent that both downloads AND plays music? Like Napster used to?!? I keep downloading things that do only one or the other!!!

Does anyone know of a program that allows me to steal computer games? What about artwork or taxi rides? Anyone know a program that allows me to take food from a shop without me having to pay for it? So I can rip off the farmer, the chef, the waitress and the diner owner all at the same time?

I keep downloading programs that don't steal stuff the way I want to!!!!

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Night Stalker: quote: Originally posted by Leonis: I've also never heard compaints from people buying say, BGII for PC and then getting irate that they can't play it (that particular hardware) on their PS2. Mobile phones don't fit every charger - each new phone I've had needed a new charger because I've had two different brands. I can't play VHS cassettes in my DVD player either. As content changes - usually due to consumer demand or needs such as copy protection, so does the means to deliver it. Is introducing copy protected music going to affect things as much as other major changes about to take place? Most analogue entertainment services will be switched off within the decade. Germany plans to turn off FM broadcast within three years. Australia has tentative dates for Digital TV broadcast switchovers. This means your TV set, Radio, Integrated entertainment system, car stereo and more will be obsolete before long. You'll still be able to play whatever you have now with whatever you have now, as you still can with vinyl records and cassettes, or Beta videos, etc...

Yes, but I can still put my new VHS tape in any old VCR and watch it. Playback may not be as great, but it works. These copy protection schemes are trying to disable certain unapproved devices, and just don't work in others. And they DON'T tell you that up front! Like Magik said - false advertising.[/QUOTE]The point was that you can't put a DVD in a VHS. Nor can you put a DVD in a CD player. To my knowledge you can put these audio CDs in most CD players, just not a personal computer.

Yes it's a pain in the arse, but who is responsible for that? If there were no pirates there'd be no need for attempts at piracy prevention.

[andrewas]

Originally posted by Yorick: quote: Originally posted by Leonis: [qb] Downloading copyrighted music without payment or permission is still illegal hence some of the debate here.

Illegal and immoral.

It's interesting to note, that you and I are to my knowledge the ONLY professional musicians on this board, let alone this debate, yet we're the only ones arguing against the theft of our property.

QB][/QUOTE]I am not saying that people should be allowed to steal your property. But there is no way I can support a copy protection scheme that will force me to spend money to listen to CDs despite already having one of the highest quality CD-players available coupled to a pair of respectable speakers. Yes, I know its bypassable, but that defeats the entire purpose. So I refuse to buy CDs protected by this scheme in the vague hope that enough consumers doing the same will force it to be abandoned.

[Thoran]

Originally posted by Yorick: Illegal and immoral. It's interesting to note, that you and I are to my knowledge the ONLY professional musicians on this board, let alone this debate, yet we're the only ones arguing against the theft of our property. To any of you guys arguing against, could you take a moment, and imagine if people were using your services, or taking your property without permission? Now, just say that people were here arguing that people SHOULD be allowed to rip off a carpenter. Not pay him for building their house if they don't feel like it. They SHOULD be able to hire ten people at your job to do your work with you, and only pay the people they feel do a job they like, no matter whether they keep the result of your unpaid labours or not.[/QB]

Perhaps I've misspoken... I fully support the right of artists to control their work, I believe music piracy is wrong. It's just that I tend to get worked up about the middle man... who I believe is just as much a crook as the kids downloading the songs illegaly.

So to complicate the moral dilema you posed above:

"Could you imagine if you worked for a company, giving that company the right to sell your output with little (or often NO) proceeds coming back to you... to the point where you HAD to travel full time and work a second job to make any money. NOW how would you feel if that company got upset because people were stealing YOUR work from them instead of paying them an excessive fee for your work."

It would seem to me that many artists would support free transfer of their music... because the more people that listen to their songs, the more that will show up a the gates... and the more money the actual ARTISTS make in the process. My problem is that many people believe music should be some public domain thing, and that's just plain WRONG... there's a big difference between choosing to allow others to freely share your work, and having it taken without a "by your leave".

Perhaps I've got the analogy wrong, I'm no musician... but this is my basic understanding of how the industry works for the VAST majority of artists.