On Cowardice

[Diogenes Of Pumpkintown]

Originally posted by Ziroc: No problem, just come out and say what you feel--no holds barred. No beating around the bush..

Um, okay. Glad to know I have your approval

Originally posted by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown: As I stated in my post, I was referring to the example of the Gulf War. Whether what we will do in Afghanistan will amount to similar terrorism against the Afghani people yet remains to be seen.

As I thought, but when you say "US bombs on civilians as in the Gulf War" you are saying we did this on propose? We singled these civilians out and killed them with bombs? I don't remember that. In WAR, there ARE (unfortunately) civilian casualties.

Now, I don't agree with the USA Sanctions against Iraq, making food sparse, and many children died from starvation.. We should have ended that better than we did. (Getting saddam hussein and flooding Iraq with food and medical help)

I understand what you are talking about, but I just don't agree with all of it..

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Ziroc™
Ironworks Webmaster
www.tgeweb.com/ironworks

[John D Harris]

Originally posted by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown: If the first example is cowardly, then the last example is too, John D., provided that the person threatening to kick ass is much stronger than his target. Where is the bravery in a strong person beating up on someone who can't really hurt him back, as is typically the case with the way the US wages wars with its planes and missles?

What makes it cowardly is that the attacker gives no warning. No massing of troops, gathering of forces in the open like MEN.
I don't know about you but I saw a lot of anti-aircraft fire (fighting back). Prehaps the Taliban should have invested in better anti-aircraft weapons before they decided to give safe harbor to usama and his ilk.
Bravery is realizing that this world is mean and full of people that want to take what you have or hurt you for who you are and taking appropate actions.



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Crustiest of the OLD COOTS
Airline ticket to Afghanistan $800
High powered rifle with scope $1000
Hotel room with roof access $100
A clean Head shot on that sack of Horse Manure Usuma Bin Laden PRICELESS!

Originally posted by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown: Um, okay. Glad to know I have your approval

You are Welcome.

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Ziroc™
Ironworks Webmaster
www.tgeweb.com/ironworks

[Liliara]

On the line of sanctions, why is the rest of the world accountable for the well being of other countries? Yes, I agree that we should help when we can, but I'm getting tired of hearing that feeding the world is our job! This country of Afghanistan has evolved in it's own way. Some say America brought the attack on themselves, well, how is it different for the Afghans other than America helped them win a war. Dang it! I'm tired of people saying America sticks it's nose in where it doesn't belong, then puts her down if she doesn't feed the world! Make up your mind!

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Captain of Bouncers, Boogre Bar

LH Member

And you never did think that it ever would happen again, in America did you? And you never did think that we'd ever get together again, but we damn sure fooled ya. We're walkin' real proud and we're talkin' real loud again, in America. And you never did think that it ever would happen again.... (Charlie Daniels)

[250]

Originally posted by Ziroc: As I thought, but when you say "US bombs on civilians as in the Gulf War" you are saying we did this on propose? We singled these civilians out and killed them with bombs? I don't remember that. In WAR, there ARE (unfortunately) civilian casualties.

HEY!!! what did I say?
I, 250, as a world leader, call out to people of the world that we stop talking about what USA did in the past, and focus on NOW!
I thought I've cleared this matter!? geesh, got to set up another meeting with Colin Powel ... **wipes out his cellar phone, and dial**

[250]

Originally posted by Liliara: On the line of sanctions, why is the rest of the world accountable for the well being of other countries? Yes, I agree that we should help when we can, but I'm getting tired of hearing that feeding the world is our job! This country of Afghanistan has evolved in it's own way. Some say America brought the attack on themselves, well, how is it different for the Afghans other than America helped them win a war. Dang it! I'm tired of people saying America sticks it's nose in where it doesn't belong, then puts her down if she doesn't feed the world! Make up your mind!

hey hey hey, easy easy... we cannot make everyone happy. but we can do the best for ourselves and our loved ones
the world is just not fair, that is why we should ignore those people's accusations, and continuely doing what WORKS! that way, we know that we made a difference, we know that we are someone who matter

[Yorick]

Originally posted by Diogenes Of Pumpkintown: Huh, did I miss something?

You must have. Wahabism has commited grave acts against other Islamics as well as the United States. We are at war with terrorism perpetuated by Wahabi extremists, not Islam.



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I am the walrus!.... er, no hang on....

A fair dinkum laughing Hyena!

[Bahamut]

Anyways, who cares anyway? They also say Osama has a big inferiority complex or something...

They are all terrorists, and they are all the same!

Brids of the same feather fly away!!!

HAHAHAH!!!!

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Mithril Cavalier of ALSB
You almost had me? You never had me! You never had your car! It is not about winning by a mile or by an inch, its about winning.

[Diogenes Of Pumpkintown]

Originally posted by Ziroc: As I thought, but when you say "US bombs on civilians as in the Gulf War" you are saying we did this on propose? We singled these civilians out and killed them with bombs? I don't remember that. In WAR, there ARE (unfortunately) civilian casualties. Now, I don't agree with the USA Sanctions against Iraq, making food sparse, and many children died from starvation.. We should have ended that better than we did. (Getting saddam hussein and flooding Iraq with food and medical help) I understand what you are talking about, but I just don't agree with all of it..

What we did to the people of Iraq was criminal. Perhaps one million civilians died from our actions in the war and afterwards, from direct and indirect causes.

Regarding your point about not really meaning to hit civilians with bombs: a brief digression to the law of Murder is informative. To be Murder, it is necessary that the defendant have some Intent to kill the victim. Now, that does not mean that the defendant has to act with the PURPOSE of killing the victim, it is only necessary for guilt that he act in the KNOWLEDGE that death will likely result. For example, say someone blows up a building, knowing that there are people inside. Say his only purpose is because he thinks the building is a complete eyesore, and he can tolerate its existence no longer. He has no desire whatsover to kill any people, only the building. That makes NO DIFFERENCE under the traditional law of Murder, and it shouldn't. It is enough for guilt that he acted in the knowledge that death would result.

When you blow up buildings, or target civilian populated areas, it is a empty, hollow claim indeed that your purpose was not to kill the people inside. The phrase "collateral damage" was a popular american euphemism for hiding our war crimes in the Gulf War.