Hating Illegals

[PurpleXVI]

Offering the "amnesty" I still think would work to some extent.

I mean, seriously, if they have to pay normal minimum wage, the corporate fellas lose all incentive to hire the illegal workers. At very first it might trigger a surge of newly legal workers, but when they find that there isn't anyone willing to hire them because they're not saving anything, it might change. Can't say for sure until it's tried, of course.

And I still think it's wrong to hate them, but I suppose we'll have to disagree on that. Most of them are doing it out of need, not because they want to wreck your system. For a lot of them it's probably either "Work illegally in the US or starve," while for the guys hiring them in the US it's "Either hire illegal workers or... GASP! MAKE SLIGHTLY LESS PROFIT!"

Another thing you might benefit from would be stronger unions. I know that at least in Denmark, our extremely powerful unions do half of the work of tracking down illegal immigrants for us, they catch a lot that the government don't, then just lead the officials to them.

It's not illegal to use foreign labour here(As long as it's from within the EU), but their employers still have to adhere to standard Danish wage laws, employee safety, etc.

Maybe you should just annex Mexico and force them to have the same minimum wage laws as you guys, then their citizens would stay at home.

[Olorin]

We see a lot of the effects of illegal immigration here in Southern California.

--Construction wages are the same as they were 15 years ago. A drywaller can't buy nearly as much on his $15/hour today as he could in 1992.

--LA County has seen the closure of several ERs (and entire hospitals) because they went bankrupt due to providing care to illegals. (And the Federal Gov't failed to compensate them as they are supposed to)

--A big part of the housing price increase in the area is due to illegal immigration. There are Americans investing in rental properties to take advantage of the illegals, and there are families of illegals getting creative financing from banks to buy houses that often house 15+ people.

Now, while I don't agree with the actions of illegal immigrants sneaking across the border, I don't really blame them. They are trying to find a better life, and the businesses here are opening their arms wide and inviting them. What I want to see is a major crackdown on businesses employing illegals. Owners and managers should face jail time for hiring illegals, PLUS I feel that all the workers involved should be deported BUT on the way, they should be given a check from their erstwhile employer to pay the difference between what they were paid, and what a fair wage for that industry is. That's the part that would scare businesses straight. It would mean that hiring illegals wouldn't save them money in the long run, because eventually, some of their workers would turn them in.

Unfortunately, too many businesses have become addicted to cheap labor, and have in turn bought too many of our politicians. I'll be seriously considering voting for Tom Tancredo in the primaries, if only to send a message that the immigration issue is important.

My pet peeve is all our politicians who keep using the phrase "jobs that Americans won't do". What they really mean is "jobs that Americans aren't willing to do for less than minimum wage". If we took away the illegal labor, I'm sure that the crops would still be picked, building would get cleaned, and all the rest; it just wouldn't be done as cheaply as companies have gotten used to. OMG they'll actually have to pay a janitor a living wage! The horror!

[Havock]

How about instead of creeping accross the border they try to improve their own country. You know, lobby their own lawmakers, go to university,clean up their cities and towns, do all of the things it takes to have a fully functional country. Maybe even cut it out with all of the B.S. excuses about why they can't do something about it. The only reasons they can't change their own country are either they are too stupid or too lazy. Haveing been a chef and surrounded by illegals in the kitchen for 12 hours a day, I would say both. Instead they invade our country like a swarm of roaches in an old tenament. I don't feel one bit sorry for them.

[PurpleXVI]

Oh, yes, because while Mexican society's weakest are getting out of the gutter and rising up to change their country, they sure won't be starving or anything.

And those who are safe and comfortable aren't about to rock the boat.

[Havock]

Originally posted by PurpleXVI: Oh, yes, because while Mexican society's weakest are getting out of the gutter and rising up to change their country, they sure won't be starving or anything. And those who are safe and comfortable aren't about to rock the boat.

The weak deserve what ever they get.

[Luther]

Originally posted by Havock: quote: Originally posted by PurpleXVI: Oh, yes, because while Mexican society's weakest are getting out of the gutter and rising up to change their country, they sure won't be starving or anything. And those who are safe and comfortable aren't about to rock the boat.

The weak deserve what ever they get. [/QUOTE]Moron. Go back to your computer games.

[PurpleXVI]

Hahahah, Havock, I could make all sorts of ad hominem attacks here, but instead I'm just going to call your opinion ridiculous. There are more ways to being at the bottom of things than being weak.

And you know what? Go ahead, disregard the weak while you sit at the top, but it's the weak that feed you, it's the weak that clothe you and it's the weak that carry you. Together, they hold more strength than you have in even one bone of your body. They could rebel and destroy society in the blink of an eye if they chose to. They could hold the world for ransom if they had the organization.

Throughout history, it has been a constant pattern that those who disregard the weak and show disdain for them, are eventually rebelled against, often destroyed by the very people they've seen as barely better than animals.

The weak deserve your every bit of attention and care, because they're the basis for your life. And if they don't feel they get what they deserve, they can easily take it away from you.

But, seriously, Havock, how old are you? However old you are you need to go work in a soup kitchen or volunteer at a hospital. Go get your hands dirty. Go meet the weak who "deserve what they get." Go meet the guy who lives in the gutter because an accident outside of his control left him crippled. Go meet someone who isn't an upper-class spoiled brat that's never wanted for anything in their life except for absurd luxuries that their parents no doubt gave them anyway.

[Dundee Slaytern]

Originally posted by Luther: quote: Originally posted by Havock: quote: Originally posted by PurpleXVI: Oh, yes, because while Mexican society's weakest are getting out of the gutter and rising up to change their country, they sure won't be starving or anything. And those who are safe and comfortable aren't about to rock the boat.

The weak deserve what ever they get. [/QUOTE]Moron. Go back to your computer games. [/QUOTE]Careful guys. While there is mitigation, please refrain from name-calling and stay on-topic.

Cheers.

[PurpleXVI]

Very well, then, let me change my post to just one series of questions for Havock.

How old are you? What is your ethnicity? What is your work history? And what is your education history?

[Nightwing]

I know a lot of illegql alliens and like every one of them. Furthermore all the ones I have known, 100s have all been tax paying workers. Not only are they paying taxes but they are not filing for tax refunds, and are paying social security which they will never collect on. They are pumpping tax revenue into our system. I know there are some who are working for cash but that is not their fault. I think we would have some major issues of companies closing their doors and throwing citizens and illegals alike out of work. I'm not sure our economy could take loosing them at this point.

Olorin, My brother is a Drywaller in california and is making $31.00 hr. as a member of the painters union. I certainly have not seen a dip in union wages. My dad was making almost$40.00 before he quit 5 years ago. Scab work my be different however.