Thread: Guns.
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Old 05-19-2002, 03:05 AM   #38
Ironworks Moderator

Join Date: February 28, 2001
Location: Boston/Sydney
Posts: 11,764
Originally posted by Scholarcs:
and dont give me any crap about how you need to defend yourselves, if you shoot someone you have murdered them, be it in self-defence or not.
Let me just try and clarify this statement, Scholarcs...killing in self-defence and murder is NOT the same thing.

Murder is the unlawful killing of one human by another, especially with premeditated malice.

Manslaughter is he unlawful killing of a man, either in negligence or incidentally to the commission of some unlawful act, but without specific malice, or upon a sudden excitement of anger.

Self-defence is the right to protect oneself against violence or threatened violence with whatever force or means are reasonably necessary.

Self-defence and manslaughter can sometimes be the same thing, but self-defence and murder can never be the same thing.

Maybe your last sentence should have read "once you shoot someone you have KILLED them, whether in self-defence or not."

I understand your strong feelings towards this issue - NZ and Australia as a whole have similar feelings towards guns in that the average citizen believes they should be restricted to a) law enforcement officers; and b) people for whom it is a lawful tool of trade (eg farmers, hunters, etc). Mace or capsicum spray isn't even legally available here. Probably because our crime rate is still quite low compared to some other countries - but I think you will find that as this increases, and home invasions, muggings, bag snatchings, etc increase, the average Joe Bloggs on the street will turn more to his own devices to protect himself and his own, rather than relying on the law.

This is probably already happening in Australian suburbs such as Cabramatta and Punchbowl, which are hotbeds of gang activity - but I would hope that the day that I feel I need to have a gun in my pocket to feel safe is still a long way away.

Memnoch is offline