[Tobbin]

Originally posted by DraconisRex: Understanding the Interrelationship of Offense and Defense in 3E Rules. 2E rules favored offense over defense through the lack of foresight by the creators. Characters were supposed to retire, or go into semi-retirement, by the time they hit the high levels (14th+...) But that didn't happen as we all got attached to our characters... Offense/defense unbalance ensued, especially with the more unbalanced pro-combat classes, the greatest offender being the Kensai. At moderately high levels, a Kensai couldn't miss (except on a one) the toughest opponent, no matter how powerful the shield and armour and all other defensive modifiers. 3E changed this. Defense Versus Offense - The Set Up A young adult Blue Dragon is terrorizing the desert town of Palm Dale. His AC is 26 against medium or smaller creatures. His attack bonuses and damages are: Bite +23, 2 Claw +18, 2 Wing +18, 1 Tail +18. 2d6 +4, 1d8 +2, 1d6 +2, 1d8 +6. Two characters answer the call. A lvl 10 ranger & a lvl 10 paladin. The Ranger: For ease, the ranger did not take dragons as a racial enemy and dual-weilds a +2 longsword with a +2 dagger. He wears +3 studded armour, has a +2 amulet and a +2 cloak with an 15 dex & 15 str. AC = 10+2+6+2+2 = 22. His attacks are: +12/+7 & +12(OH) The Paladin: +1 Full Plate, +3 Tower Shield, +2 longsword. +2 amulet, +2 cloak. 16 Str, 10 Dex. AC = 10+0+9+6+2+2 = 29. Her atacks are: +15/+10. Dragon v. Defender Dragon attacks Ranger Rick 1 Attack at +23 vs AC 22. Needs to roll a 2 or better. 5 Attacks at +18 vs AC 22. Needs to roll a 4 or better. Average expected damage to Ranger per MR: Bite = 10 Claws = 11 Wings = 9 Tail = 9 Total = 39 The Dragon attacks Paladin Paula 1 Attack at +23 vs AC 29. Needs to roll a 6 or better. 5 Attacks at +18 vs AC 29: Needs to roll an 11 or better. Average expected damage to Paladin per MR: Bite = 8 Claws = 7 Wings = 6 Tail = 6 Total = 29 (10 HPs less damage per MR). In our example a Ranger would be lucky to last deep, if at all, into the 3rd melee round. The Paladin might make it to the 4th round. except that a dragon can't really bring all those attacks to bear on one a single individual. Attacker vs Dragon The ranger attacks as follows: 1 Attack (MH) at +12, needs a 14 or better to hit. 1 Attack (OH) at +12, needs a 14 or better to hit. 1 Attack (MH) at +7, needs a 19 or better to hit. Expected avg. damage dealt per MR: 6 The paladin attacks as follows: 1 Attack at +15, needs an 11 or better to hit. 1 Attack at +10, needs a 16 or better to hit. Expected avg. damage dealt per MR: 8 So, what we can see is that defense now plays a far greater role against tough opponents. Dual weilding, while "flashy" and "fun," does not increase the survival chances of a player character against strong opponents. But that's not fair you say? Take the paladin and dual-weild her (using the feats and cheating to get ambidexterity) in her +1 full plate. She'll die as fast as the ranger. Give the ranger a big shield, he'll survive as long as the paladin. The Role of Dual-Weilding There is a legitimate role for dual-weilding. Against numerous, weak foes. At that point, the difference between a 22 AC and a 29 AC won't be as apparent due to the weakness of the opponents attacks. CR1 & CR2 monsters would pose little offensive threat to either the ranger or the paladin.

The numbers look pretty good, but my 9th level Ranger has 29 AC, just like the Paladin. Plus, I have improved dual with ambidexterity which lessens the penalties significantly. With a shield, I have 34 AC, so I can give you that. My main problem is that high level enemies are more than likely going to hit my character anyways (whether I have 29 or 34 AC), so I prefer to "get in" more damage to take him out. I can always use potions to beef me up or use boots of striding to raise hp's (I am using boots of speed to help with AC though). Just depends on how you play. I don't know that many characters that will go toe to toe with a dragon (without some heavy beefing). I normally opt for the hit and run mode. I hit them until I get near enough to death it's worrisome, then run to go heal up. Then come back in and finish the job. Ranged attacks can help out here too (depending on how good you are with your weapons.) A straight out fighter is the best to go toe to toe with an enemy though (unless you have to fight through magic to get to them.)