Ironworks Gaming Forum - View Single Post - Oh Keldorn you selfrighteous bastard you...

CerebroDragon · 08-24-2006, 11:27 AM

Solid point, Klorox. The more you think about it, the less paradoxical it seems for a 'lawful good' character to have such a generalised prejudice based on race.

@Jorath. Not sure I understand your sentence mate, sorry!

I think it is important however to recognise that by and large in D&D's black and white morality, drow are considered evil often in quite justifiable terms. Its a generalisation, sure, but based on some degree of fact. Ask any Faerun elven family who have lost members due to the infamous murderous drow raids on the surface for instance...but I digress.

@Illumina

I did say I was referring to a specific interpretation of racism with Keldorn. In doing so, I was trying to draw a distinction between your everyday prejudice based upon a generalised morality and actual full-on racism where a race is deemed inferior in intelligence, ability or of lesser hierarchal rank simply due to the colour of one's skin or something equally racially driven.

Now whilst I think Keldorn is obviously guilty of the former type of prejudice, (based upon his patriarchal "paladinly" morality - his treatment of Viconia a testament to this) I'm not so sure if his beliefs can be said to belong to the latter type, thus the reasons for my doubts and earlier claims. [img]smile.gif[/img]

So to attempt a basic summary of what I'm trying to say, here's a couple of possible examples:

"All drow are evil because they are nasty pieces of work, worship evil godesses and openly commit evil acts" (a generalised moral prejudice which Keldorn is more guilty of.)

"All drow are evil, weak and inferior because they have dark skin, spindly little arms and legs, evidencing their lesser genes." (a much more blatantly racist, if somewhat flippant example. But hopefully my distinction makes more sense now.)

I'm sure we can add more to this and analyse some actual concrete comments from Keldorn to broaden the discussion. If someone would like to put forward some actual quotes, that'd be cool!

Cheers,
CD

[ 08-24-2006, 11:31 AM: Message edited by: CerebroDragon ]

08-24-2006, 11:27 AM	#10
CerebroDragon Red Wizard of Thay Join Date: March 2, 2003 Location: Ballarat, Australia. Age: 45 Posts: 878	Solid point, Klorox. The more you think about it, the less paradoxical it seems for a 'lawful good' character to have such a generalised prejudice based on race. @Jorath. Not sure I understand your sentence mate, sorry! I think it is important however to recognise that by and large in D&D's black and white morality, drow are considered evil often in quite justifiable terms. Its a generalisation, sure, but based on some degree of fact. Ask any Faerun elven family who have lost members due to the infamous murderous drow raids on the surface for instance...but I digress. @Illumina I did say I was referring to a specific interpretation of racism with Keldorn. In doing so, I was trying to draw a distinction between your everyday prejudice based upon a generalised morality and actual full-on racism where a race is deemed inferior in intelligence, ability or of lesser hierarchal rank simply due to the colour of one's skin or something equally racially driven. Now whilst I think Keldorn is obviously guilty of the former type of prejudice, (based upon his patriarchal "paladinly" morality - his treatment of Viconia a testament to this) I'm not so sure if his beliefs can be said to belong to the latter type, thus the reasons for my doubts and earlier claims. [img]smile.gif[/img] So to attempt a basic summary of what I'm trying to say, here's a couple of possible examples: "All drow are evil because they are nasty pieces of work, worship evil godesses and openly commit evil acts" (a generalised moral prejudice which Keldorn is more guilty of.) "All drow are evil, weak and inferior because they have dark skin, spindly little arms and legs, evidencing their lesser genes." (a much more blatantly racist, if somewhat flippant example. But hopefully my distinction makes more sense now.) I'm sure we can add more to this and analyse some actual concrete comments from Keldorn to broaden the discussion. If someone would like to put forward some actual quotes, that'd be cool! Cheers, CD [ 08-24-2006, 11:31 AM: Message edited by: CerebroDragon ] __________________ Diddledy High, Diddledy Low, Come Brave Blood Sheep, You've a goodly way to go. - Brilhasti Ap Tarj