[Vaskez]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Okay, Vaskez, read your long post. Still I do not waver. There is a human immortal soul. It is the teleological story of the species-being's growth, maturation, and existence over time. I am very spiritual. I have a duty to future generations of human beings and a responsibility for my actions that extends beyond the end of my life not because I will get rewarded or punished but rather because it is my little job in the vastness of human history. However, I see no reason to believe in a God. The universe is eternal - I don't need to dream up some imaginary being and say he/she/it created the universe because that simple begs another question, to wit who made God? I am humbled by the immortality of all that is and do not need to personify it into a "God." That is the worst kind of arrogance for a human to engage in. I do support organized religion, however, and I have written tomes on this very board regarding that. Put simply, I think I'm smart enough and responsible enough and educated enough try to do the right thing without the "carrot and stick" of religion, but I don't trust all of my fellow humans to be quite so smart, responsible, or educated.

Yeah as I said this thread wasn't about the benefits or drawbacks or religion, only about why people don't believe in a God. Personally I think what IS arrogant is people who think that they know everything they need to know to live well. I have given loads of reasons to believe in a God. Even if you don't agree with them, don't say that you don't see any reason because there are many. I have already answered your question about who made God? That is the oldest argument out there I wish we didn't have to go around in circles. I think that God is the only thing that didn't need anything/one else to create him. That's why he is God i.e. supreme being. You believe what my ex-gf believed - the eternity of the universe itself. She would say - why does anything need to have a beginning and an end? Well that's not good enough to put my mind at rest as atoms don't think and yet we have a wonderfully complex world that even thinking humans can't figure out except in tiny steps.