[Cerek the Barbaric]

Whew! Where to begin? So many topics, points, and counterpoints - far too many to address individually.

Melusine - I have waited this long to join the thread because of the pattern it was following. I was truly impressed with all the responses on the 1st page. They were honost answers to the questions put forth by Vaskez and - for once - avoided the recurring cycle of harsh criticisms and defensive responses that these threads usually generate. Then Yorick and Dagorian began debating the issue of wars caused by religions. I'm sorry guys, but these arguments have been hashed and rehashed and they also didn't address the questions or the main topic of this thread.

I'm glad to see it heading back to main focus Vaskez originally intended.

Now for my own response to the topic at hand.

Why I believe in God

I believe in God because I have personally felt His presence in my life in various situations. I was raised in a Christian home, so I always "believed" in God...but I didn't really become a Christian until I accepted God on my own initiative and for my own reasons. Up until that time, I had just been "going through the motions". My belief in God is not in response to my being "unable to accept the fact that there is no real purpose for us being here". I do not need answers to "unanswerable questions". I just realized one night in church that I had never actually committed my life to Jesus and that I needed to do that if I were going to continue calling myself a Christian.

The Bible says that "a peace which surpasseth all understanding" will come over you when you turn your troubles over to God. I can vouch 100% for that...I have felt this inexplicable peace on many different occasions when I faced circumstances in my life that were simply beyond my ability to control. When I tried to control the circumstances on my own, my stress levels rose through the roof and the situation only got worse. When I finally went to God in prayer and said "I cannot handle this. I turn it over to you" - I immediately felt a wave of calm come over me and I had a feeling of assurance that everything would work out OK. And it always has - even though it didn't always work out the way I had wanted it too. In the end, God's solution was far better than anything I could have done on my own.

I believe in God because of an ongoing relationship I have with Him through Jesus Christ. My faith is not based on the Bible, it is based on the real events in my life that have been influenced by the presence of God in my life. I do believe the Bible is the Word of God. All of the things I've experienced are also documented in the Bible and follow the same experiences other Christians have had. I have never found any part of the Bible to be false, in my personal experience. The Bible documented what would I happen if I would accept God and Jesus Christ on faith. I tried it and it happened exactly like the Bible said it would. Therefore, I trust what the Bible says about any other issues or questions I have. However, my faith is still based on my personal relationship with God and not "because the Bible says so". Those who claim to believe the Bible, but don't have an ongoing relationship with God, are the ones who feel it is "God's Will" to bomb abortion clinics or kill thier neighbor for having a different belief.

I have heard atheists call the Bible "nothing more than a collection of fables and fairy tales". That is actually a very accurate description for someone who doesn't have the Holy Spirit of God within them to help them understand the messages and symbolism the various stories represent. The best way for me to explain it is to say that I always "believed" the stories of the Bible while growing up...but I didn't truly "understand" them until after my Salvation.

Speaking of which, Melusine mentioned the fact that I believe a heinous criminal can be forgiven of their sins and enter Heaven while a "goodly person" can be barred from Heaven because they didn't accept Jesus Christ as their Savior. Technically, that is correct. The Bible does say that "good works alone" are not enough to make it into Heaven. But this applies more to the "Sunday Christians" who think that - as long as they go to church and act nice to people - they are "good to go". And that just isn't the way it works. When a person truly accepts Jesus Christ as thier Savior, the Holy Spirit will enter into their heart and transform them. They will be a changed person and act in a manner more closely attuned to God's Will. Many people who consider themselves Christians, never actually make this "full time commitment" to God. It is these people that the Bible is addressing.

Can a person that lives a "good life", but does not accept Jesus Christ as their Savior get into Heaven? That's a tricky question. Certainly by human standards, that person "deserves" to have a wonderful after-life - but we humans aren't the ones who get to choose who goes and who doesn't. Only God can do that. And God does judge the HEART of a person, not their head. These discussions have led me to "expand" my view a bit. Our souls enter Heaven by Grace alone. NOTHING we do on Earth can EARN us the right to be in Heaven...all we can do is trust in the Grace and Mercy of God and Jesus Christ. For most Christians, this means accepting the Sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the Cross as an atonement for our sins. We are still getting into Heaven by Grace, it is the Grace of Jesus Christs Love. But a person can also enter Heaven through the Grace of God Himself. The thief on the cross was not able to accept Jesus as his Savior, but he still entered Heaven because of the Grace granted by God.

So, yes, a "good hearted person" could enter Heaven - if God allowed it.