First of all, let me say I am atheist, and generally against clergy and all the paraphernalia that go along with religions. However I would say the first part of your speech is a bit simplicistic and in some parts, in my humble opinion, wrong.
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All of these were originally posted by Callum Kerr:
Religion represents a huge financial and work burden on mankind. It's not just a matter of religious believers wasting their money on church buildings; think of all the time and effort spent building churches, praying, and so on. Imagine how that effort could be better spent.
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Have you ever seen churches like St. Peter in Rome or St. Mary of Grace in Milan or others in Florence, Turin, well about anywhere here in Italy?
They are considered the greatest achievements of artist like Michelangelo, Leonardo, Tiziano, Raffaello, Giotto and many others... Those were all built by means of money taken from mankind, which could have been used differently.
Have you ever read the Comedy by Dante Alighieri, or even Shakespeare, and why not, the Odyssey and the Iliad, and most of the Masterpiecies of the world literature (not only of the western literature, mind that...)? Most of them are based on religion or are somehow religion related...What would be our literature without religion?
Have you ever read anything by Max Weber, a german sociologist? He tries, in one of his books (protestant ethics and capitalism spirit) to prove that the capitalism originates directly from the belief, typical of calvinist and reformed churches, that wealth is a sign of godwill, hence being rich is no more a sin (as was considered by catholics ethics) but something to be sought for god's greater glory... Capitalism is something which plays a small role in our society, you know...
What I am trying to say is that religion, any religion, not only Christian religion has influenced every society who has ever been built on Earth from 100000 b.C to the present day. And in particular, since there are few "big" religions, it has been those who have left the greatest mark on what we are today. If you keep this in mind, trying to split benefits and burdens of religion becomes quite hard, nevermind imagining what the world would have been without religion.
Obviously I don't deny that religions have had and have many downsides, you named many and I will name a couple more, just as an example: Twin Towers, Osama Bin Laden and so on... Pearl Harbor (remember the Japanese had a terrible superiority complex due to their religion...).
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Can anyone tell us of an instance when they did not do something, because they were afraid of going to hell, or being otherwise punished BY GOD, not by parents?
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You named Socrates as the "founder" of atheistic morality.
Immanuel Kant (which was by the way deeply religious) tried to do the same... my english isn't good enough to get knee deep in philosophical terms, but you could try to find something about his categoric imperatives (Prolegomena to Any Future Metaphysics (1783) and Critique of Practical Reason (1788)) In my opinion his works on absolute morals are enlightening.
Notable are also his opinions about the fact that it is imnpossible to demonstrate the existence (or non existence) of God.
About the nature of God:
I think it was Nietsche (but I am far from sure) who said that God is either good or almighty... Maybe that could be a starting point if you really wish to commit suicide by venturing in the most discussed phylosophical problem ever... good luck
[ 11-26-2002, 11:41 AM: Message edited by: B_part ]