[Cerek the Barbaric]

Originally posted by Grojlach: Sorry Cerek, but dragging other articles in here is actually a non-argument to make a case... Saying how others have posted misleading articles themselves before doesn't make it any less wrong that this particular article was written in such a misleading way in the first place; and trying to point out the hypocrisy in Rokenn's actions still doesn't disprove the fact that the Washington Times deliberately left out a few lines which made Kamiya look a lot worse than he really was, inspiring many of us to distance ourselves from his comments.

I respectfully disagree that "dragging other articles in here is actually a non-argument" because both articles represent a deliberate slanting of the facts in order to present a certain viewpoint and both articles were quoted by Ironworks members in order to generate discussion

Originally posted by Grojlach: And if you *do* think the "hypocrisy" is relevant: there's a slight difference between the methods of posting used by Iron Ranger and Rokenn for the two mentioned articles. Rokenn seemed to post it in a light-hearted "teehee, silly!" kind of manner, more in a teasing way (and you and MagiK were about the only ones who decided to take it seriously - maybe too seriously, compared to the other replies ); while Iron Ranger's topic was of a different nature from the beginning - the use of "disgusted", a "it-may-piss-them-off-but-I'm-not-saying-all-liberals-think-like-this!"-insinuating semi-accusation (as if we should somehow feel addressed to every time they're talking about nuttcases on "the left" ) and the not so silly controversial nature of the article are responsible for a wholly different atmosphere. That's not necessarily Iron Ranger's fault, as he merely posted an article he stumbled upon in the kind of newspaper he reads ( ) and shared his feelings over what was written; but when it turns out that the article was deliberately misquoting, it makes it a lot more awkward than when someone suddenly comes up with an article in which the stewardess is giving "her side" of the story, mostly because the nature of the debates in Rokenn's topic was a lot less heated and controversial than was the case in Iron Ranger's topic. B]

Iron Rangers opening comments may have been more adversarial in nature, but I disagree that the "controversial nature of the article represents a wholly different atmosphere". Obviously it does for you, but it didn't for me because I didn't take Iron Rangers article any more seriously than you took Rokenns. And there is another difference which you pointed out - but seemed to feel is irrelevant. Iron Ranger did not know his article was a deliberate mis-representation, but Rokenn did.

I agree the "Nursing mother" article didn't create as much controversy on Ironworks as the selective-quotation of Kamiya's article did...but it certainly DID create and/or perpetuate anti-American sentiment among the readers of the article itself. And if you look over my posts, you will see that this was my main criticism of the article. Even if it was done in jest, the sentiment and reaction it created were real.