[Barry the Sprout]

I think I should come back to what really started this topic. If I remember rightly it was a newspaper article written about me that described me as "anti American". My problem with the article was that I am not "anti American" - it is just something I get branded with occasionally. Cloudy, Ronn, Magness:

I do not mind in the slightest you attacking what I beleive.

I DO mind you attacking what I don't beleive.

I think Hiram has a point, although I think SC does as well. We should remember that there are oppressed people all over the world, even in the richest country. I am an International Marxist, the true evil in this world is capitalism as it is a system that gives wealth to the few and poverty to the many.

The people who should have the blame for this action are the people who for years have manipulated soveriegn countries in order to further their own wealth. They are not just American, they come from all over. As Cloudy says there are probably plenty of rich Arabs out there who could contribute to to the world a lot more than they do.

I personally beleive that boudaries between countries are artificial. The biggest crime of the international capitalist is that they have got us fighting each other. This system, in the words of... actually I am sure you can guess who said it, "turns worker against worker".

What is unfortunate is that American policy is controlled by capitalists. Not Bush and Cheney but the people behind them. I am not talking smoke filled rooms kind of stuff here - just the fact that large companies have huge influence over politicians. So aid will be given in order to maintain a humanitarian image (I am not arguing that it doesn't help, what I mean is that we shouldn't ignore the purpose behind it).

What does it mean to be the richest country? Well, it means that you have the highest concentration of capitalists. America has done quite well out of it as trickle-down does work to an extent. But as Hiram says, there are still people being exploited there. I agree with SC, this doesn't mean that you should stop looking outwards but that you should start to sort out society. And the first step on that path in my veiw is Socialism, not going to happen for a while in the US admittedly but that would be my answer.

To your point, Magness, about countries acting in their own interests. I agree in part. I think they do - but I am using a different definition of country. In this case the country is the collection of capitalists who control the policy. I don't think it is in the interests of the American public in the long run to bomb afghanistan, but it is happening anyway. Why did America finance bay of Pigs et al in Latin America? Were the American public threatened or were American capitalists interests threatened?

I do feel very sorry for SC as she appear to be the only anti war person on this forum apart from me. Some of the stuff on here is pretty infuriating to read and might be considered flamebait under a different light. Not attacking anyone with that - I am just saying that the atmosphere is enough to irritate anyone. So please have some patience, or sypmathy, whichever you find easier.

I would like to finish with a thought. I agree that Exxon and Microsoft could put a hell of a lot more back from what they have taken. So could BP and Virgin, and I think SC would probably agree with me being in Greenpeace.

(were you on the Brent Spar at all BTW? Just wanted to know really...)