06-30-2004, 02:23 PM
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#108
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chewbacca:
Just who the hell do you think you are to question another American's patriotism? Not to mention it has never been proven that Moore skews facts or invents lies to promote his love of country.
I the hell, am an American Citizen who is permitted by the owner of this site to state an opinion. I did not, in fact say Moore was one thing or another, I expressed an opinion that he MAY, be one thing or another. I also said that I did not buy his story. (that is a judgement on my part akin to an OPINION) I also stated MY opinion as to what I thought of his character.
In fact it has never been proven that he is a liar, though many have tried and it is, on the whole, questionable that he has broadly skewwed facts with intent to decive, though it seems some mistakes have been made.
In fact it has on several occasions. If you do not want a republican saying so to be proof, then try out Former NY Mayor Ed Koch (a democrat) who just today released his review of the movie. He flat out called Mikey a liar on the radio this morning.
He does what any opinion maker does- Uses the facts to show one-side of an issue.
The several instances that it can proven conclusivley that facts were wrong are minor inj my opinion, perhap even mere unacknowledged mistakes. Still even if Moore skewwed some facts, how does that make it right to call into question his love of country? It doesn't.
I have yet to see any act or comment made by Mr. Moore that indicates he does anything for love of country. I havent seen anything but empty words. Words without deeds are...well pretty light in the proof department.
Tell the truth-you just dont like Moores politics. That is why you question his patriotism.
Actually not only do I not like Moores politics (which I make no secret about) I also do not like him the man...or at least the man he shows himself to be in his HBO specials (who knows what he is really like?)...where he's dressed like a bum ambushing Government Officials and trying to paint them as the ones doing the offending..when he is actually instigating the hostile reactions. I don't like his style, and I don't like the way he promotes his agenda. And I STILL have the right to express my opinions about him ..or at least untill he sics lawyers on me to shut me up...or Dan asks me not to post on the issue.
Making mistakes or skewwing facts is irrelevant to with regars to Moore's Patriotism. If that were the case the whole Bush adminstration doesn't love as well for their mistakes and fact skewwing with regards to the Iraq war.
I think your behavior-, not Moores show a true lack of some American values. Like making claims that people with who question or offer a perspctive you disagree with are terror supporters or dont love their country, or don't support their troops- is what I think is frankly well... Un-American.
Well if I lack American Values..can you tell me what my values are..and wich country they belong to? Or at least point out valuse I demonstrate that are un-american?
Do you support American values like Free Speech, Free political expression and freedom to dissent? I'm just asking, some of the things you have said lead me to believe you do not entirely.
I don't recall ever having denied Mr. Moore his free Speech..nor advocating that he have his revoked. I believe I have exercised MY right to free speech to express my opinions about the man...but no where have I denied him or tried to deny him his rights.
edit- Maybe you just don't realize you behavior seems this way. I hope this is the case.
edit 2- I realize it is somewhat ironic that one hand I am taking you to task for the opinion that Moore doesnt love his country and on the other I offer the opinion that some of your ideas are contrary to American ideals. I see the two things as different though.
I am still trying to figure out which of my ideals are not american. It would help if you could point them out for me. We have already discussed the fact that I have NOT denied or advocated denying anyone their right to free speech.
For the record I am not questioning your Patriotism or love of country- I just have a very hard time understanding how you can make such claims based on the rationale provided.
No problem, didn't see anywhere that you questioned patriotism at all....or Love of country. I just think that maybe you read what I think about moore and assumed I was saying something I wasn't.
Also-
I have no credit for the naysayers who wont or dont go see the film, but offer criticism and articles that are full of bluster but lacking substance like this one and others:
http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723
I haven't seen the film and probably won't as I do not want to put Money in Moore's pocket. However when I have "facts" detailed from the movie listed out here in threads, I will not feel the slightest disinclined to comment on what is posted here, including supplying rebuttal information to the post.
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[ 06-30-2004, 02:32 PM: Message edited by: MagiK ]
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