[LordKathen]

Originally posted by Yorick: quote: Originally posted by LordKathen: Yet, I am not just saying god does not exist. I am saying that supernaturalality does not exist, and basing that on imperical science. There is a diferance. There are scientist who do believe in god and have vast knowledge of science, granted. But to me, it is not logical to combine the two. One explains the anomaly of the other. The simple fact that there is legend after "factual" legend, and stories and myths and writings, etc. throughout time, just confirms to me that the human imagination has evolved right along with the brain. The earliest hominids, having a quarter the brain we have today, needed to "explain" that bright light streaking across the sky. And while they we're at it explain all those little sparkly lights in the sky. And fire, whoooaa! And lightning... you get my point. Meanwhile some came along with enough cleverness to "explain" these happenings to the clan and gain power. Thus started religion. To use psychological experiences to "proove" experience with god, does not sell me. Have you actually seen god? Talked to god? Touched god, physicaly? Untill this happens all you're experiencing is the very powerfull mind at work. To you, Yorick, I am arrogant to say this is it. Thats fine, but I will not spend my only life having "faith" in the supernatural.

Basing it on Empirical science? Have you personally tested these things or are you putting faith in the tests and conclusions of others? Are you yourself the said scientist or is the scientist your priest and advisor on these matters?

You are reaching. There is no empiricaly tested science in the supernatural, only the natural. Of course I am not "the" scientist. I choose to believe the empirical sciences of educated people. That is the point of empirical testing, to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the theory is fact.
In order for you to test your faith empiricaly, I would have to be able to test what happened to you. Not possable.
Just becouse faith is "tested" by many, it is all individual. It is not empirical.

You need faith to simply walk out the door Kathen. To drive a car, get on a plane, eat food you bought. You are living in faith more than you realise.

Walk? Drive a car? Eat food? Faith in what????
Now your really reaching...

As to religion, my faith is my own. Yes I accept facts and opinions from ancient times and co-aligning with others who follow Jesus, but my faith is my own. Developed by me, in the here and now. With scientific method of perpetual testing, crosstesting and comparison. I am continually assessing my faith. It is not dead and unchallengeable, but alive and growing.

Well, you got the opinions part right. The only facts are some relics and humans that lived at that time. That says nothing of the supernatural, being fact.

I use science to expand my faith, They are not mutually exclusive things Kathen, but harmonious.

"Have you seen God?" No,, I haven't seen the wind either, but I feel it, see it's effects and it changes me. Just as I feel God, see his effects and handiwork, and he changes me. I also haven't seen love either, yet I have felt it, seen it's effects and had it change me.

God and love. The bible says God is love. Have you seen love Kathen? Talked to love? Touched love physically?

But, wind is explained empiricaly. We know why its there, how it gets ther, etc.
Love is an emotion. Witch would fall under psychology.


Not all that exists is "physical".

Yes I have talked to God, and yes he has answered. In more ways than one. Yes I feel Gods love.

So you have heard his voice? Or thought you heard his voice?

The question is the important thing. It is pointless to ask "have you touched God" or "what created God" as the questions presuppose ideas outside the notion of what God is.

Yes God has touched me. Physically. Spiritual connection manifesting physical reaction.

Just like love.

Is that right? Physically? Proove it.
Becouse you have an emotion that couses a physical reaction does not make the emotion physical.
Just like love.


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