Quote:
Originally posted by Faceman:
I am not a Pantheist nor do I know enough about Pantheism to constuctively enter a serious discussion about it.
I have never contested your view on Pantheism Yorick, but you choice of words.
I love simplifying, I really do. And when I'm discussing with only people I know I will often use the most crude and simplicistic metaphors available even if they are offensive.
This however is a public board and in public discussion you gotta be a bit mor careful. If some of your metaphors offer obvious possibilities of offense you should IMHO find other metaphors that do not.
Whatever your concept of it may be, "to wank" or "wanker" are swear-words and to compare another's religion to such may be offensive to him.
If it's only a metaphor I can't see why you won't let it go and just find another.
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There is simply no other way of describing what I was seeking to describe. Sorry. Offense or no, that's how I see it. I would have hoped respect for honest and challenging discussions between searchers of truth would have been more important than censorship and euphemistic pandering to shameful insecurities. It seems I am wrong.
So.... as a result we now have divergent discussions, as a couple of issues have been raised.
Firstly, masturbation. Wanking. Self love. Whatever you want to call it, euphemisticly or bluntly.
You, the self proclaimed atheist, used religion as a justifier, citing shame, guilt and sin as elements which give it a negative connotation, therefore making it forbidden in a discussion about the nature of the universe, despite it's applicability.
I, as the fundamentalist Christian extremist, am quite comfortable with speaking about a practice generally held to be practiced by all men, and a vast majority of women.
Surely we can see the irony here. And yet a truth becomes apparent. My faith has removed GUILT and CONDEMNATION. My faith has increased SELF ACCEPTANCE.
So. Let's explore it a little further. Why do you regard it as a negative? Why is it so negative to you, that it is inadmissable as an appropriate simplification? What about it is so offensive and horrifying?
*It doesn't hurt anyone.
*It doesn't adversely affect anyone.
*It's a pleasurable experience.
The only negative thing about it is precisely why I brought it up. It is not as good as sex. Self love is not as fulfilling and satisfying as being with another person. Or to be blunt and straight to the point, wanking isn't as good as sex.
Because that is so apparent and so clear and so obvious, I made the analogy with loving, discovering, communicating with, and exploring God and his art, as seen under pantheistic and monotheistic worldviews.
My whole life is about love. The reason for existence I have stumbled upon is love. I believe the bible when it says, "God is love". I believe the bible when it says "We love him, because he first loved us".
It stands to reason, if this is my reality, that if love is my reason for existence, that I would be EXTREMELY dissatisfied with a worldview that says I am having a toss.