[Cerek the Barbaric]

Originally posted by Timber Loftis: Skunk and Cerek, as I said, I think a proper mix of "loss of freedom" and "physical" punishment, each with a decent smattering of embarrassment every now and then, is best. I like Paladin's post above. Like him, I was spanked, and I'm no mass murderer or anything. I've never seen a shrink, I got over my problems with my parents shortly after college, and I am seemingly reasonably well-adjusted from what I can discern. I think the whole non-violence movement in the western world is way out of control. Some of the best things that I've seen happen to kids have included getting the crap beat out of them by fellow kids, getting paddled in front of the whole class at school, and getting a good smack in the mouth to stymie them while they were abusing the "people are watching" factor in a public place. I think we've gotten too namby-pamby. In our fear that every parent will end up abusive, we've neutered what parenting is meant to be. Skunk, the "lazy parenting" part is quite offensive. Most of the lazy parents I've seen never hit their kids, but rather let them annoy the piss out of the rest of us. I don't know about other parents on here, but you've insulted my parents, and you've insulted me based on what I intend to be like as a parent. If there is anything I am not, and my parents are not, it is lazy. In fact, hard work is the one virtue we all extol above all others. I ask you not repeat the sentiment again.

Timber, my man, I couldn't agree with you more. This is one of the biggest problems parents - and especially teachers - face in today's society.

I remember getting taken into the hallway or up to the front of the room for a spanking. Even in the hallway, the "embarassment factor" was still there, because it echoed up and down the halls and everybody knew that somebody had just got a spanking. And going to the "Principal's Office" was the ultimate threat.

My mother recently retired after working 26 years as an office manager for a mental health facility. It was a "psycho hospital", just a small office with several counselors available to meet the needs of the community.

Every one of the counselors firmly embraced the "Do NOT spank the child for ANY reason" and you know what happened....their kids were some of the most "out of control" little hellions you will ever meet. Admittedly, some were not nearly as bad as others, but a few of them were some of the rudest, most disrespectful kids I ever met. Why? Because they were NEVER PUNISHED for doing anything wrong. The parents tried the "Sit them down and talk to them routine", but when the kids got older, they basically told their parents to "F*** Off", and STILL didn't get punished for it.

Kids have to respect their parents and other kids, and sometimes that respect has to be taught through hard lessons.

I agree that a good "mix" of punishments is the most appropriate. And as my boys get older, I find that I don't have to spank them nearly as often (although the middle one has an extremely stubborn streak in him [img]graemlins/dontknowaboutyou.gif[/img] ). I'm afraid he gets spanked far more often than his brother, only because that is sometimes the ONLY way to make him stop what he is doing.

His older brother is the whiner, but he has quickly learned that my wife and I will NOT tolerate that. He is told that whining is not the way to get what he wants and he loses privileges immediately if he persists.

This "mix" usually works pretty well and we are always told by other people how well-behaved our children are. [img]graemlins/wow.gif[/img] I sometimes have to ask if we're talking about the same child, but they assure me we are. The thing is, kids will "push" thier parents a LOT farther than they will a babysitter, or Sunday-school teacher, or any other adult that has to "watch" them for a period of time. So my wife and I take comfort in the fact that they are learning the lessons we want them to. We just wish they would practice them more often when they're home. [img]graemlins/laugh3.gif[/img]