[quote]Originally posted by Yorick:
Well, I disagree. Meditation is an emptying of the mind. Clearing it of clutter, focussing on thinking nothing or concentrating on a singular thought. One can meditate and pray. Were they the same one could not. Prayer is I repeat communicating with the Creator. The intent and application are totally different. It is conversation. It involves using the mind. [QUOTE]
No it isn't. You can never empty the mind, thoughts will always come in. It's not attaching to thoughts that is the key thing. That's the beginning place in meditation, and that can be taken further. However, that state of mind can then be used to do all kinds of stuff! You can use the mind to move outwards, or you can use that state of mind to receive. It's useful for accessing not only your own unconscious, but also the collective unconcious. If you think meditation is just sitting around being empty, think again! Like I said, that's just mode of using it...... Another way of looking at it is a passive form of prayer. Opening the self to receive and experience the divine, (whatever aspect of it). In meditation, you can reach out, or you can receive. It's like there's a masculine and a feminine mode of meditating. Clearing the mind for a more passive reception, or the more active visualisation, pathworking, exploring the deeps kind. Meditation can work very much on the level of wordless communication with the divine. It can be prayer, but does not have to be.
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Regarding the earth not being a painting, no of course not. It was an analogy. My belief remains however that universe is a work of art. As an artist I see evidence of such all the time. I also see a seperate artist, and used the analogy to illustrate (however badly) an effect of pantheist thought. [QUOTE]
Your point on this being?
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Regarding your speculation on the effect of self-worship, it is just that. If we all followed the words of Jesus we'd have a very peaceful world too. [QUOTE]
Like I said, I've no problem with the idea of self worship (ie.love) nor do I have a problem with following the words of Jesus. They both get us to the same place.
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I believe, that self love taken to the extreme - selfishness at the expense of others - is the root cause of much inconsideration, pain and destruction.[QUOTE]
Selfishness has nothing at all to do with the kind of love I mean. I'm talking about the care of oneself that enables one to care for others and the planet. For example, if I indulge in actions that damage me (I can speak with some authority on this) such as drinking so much that I hurt myself and others around me, I might think I'm giving myself nice things that I like, but in fact I'm killing myself. Same with riding rough shod over friends and family. That is not love of the self. That kind of behaviour comes from self hatred and insecurity. Actions that come from self love benefit the self. When I eat properly, I have self love. When I exercise my body, I do. When I show love or patience to my friends, I have self love. But when I am insecure, and feel the need to defend myself violently or hotly, then I'm no longer centred in myself, and no longer acting from self love.
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The awareness that a God cares for you enough to breathe life in you, and die for you can give a balanced self-love. Tempered with humility in the face of such power. Surely we all know the danger of hubris.
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But I DO have this! I don't think you understand this way of believing Yorick, and why should you? But in many ways it is much the same as yours. I can feel the universe around me wrapping me in its love every day. Its the same thing, even though we call it by different names and see it in different ways. Neither of us is 'right' and both of us are 'right'. What is right for us as individuals is right, and neither of us have the right to call the other wrong. Go with what works for you, that's what I say. If it enhances your life, then surely it must be good.
Finally, I am a creature of breaking habits. Spontanaity rather than ritual for me. If I get into a ritualised rut I seek to break it. But not all the time (that would be a ritual) I concur that we humans are creatures of habit and ritual, and that for some it provides a measure of comfort and security. For me, life is most exciting when the rules change, when the boundaries move, and when the unexpected occurs.
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Ascended Mistress of Illumination OR Paws R Us