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Dang · 06-08-2004, 05:58 PM

Well, just so you know, I have already started 2 new parties, so I'm obviously hooked.

Responding to Bungleau

"1) Mario Bros: If I have to video-game jump to complete certain objectives, can I please not get stuck on objects for no good reason? Which leads to:
Which area was this? Getting the fire ward in the last spot in the shrine? Or someplace else? Or are you referring to tree-surfing?"

I can't remember any specific instances, but in several different areas I have managed to get stuck, sometimes on a wall, and not been able to get off. A lot of times the problem will be that my selected character is the Oomphaz, and if I switch to a Ratling or Pixie I can move again. Sometimes jumping fixes it. But there have been certain cases where I can't seem to get loose no matter what. The first time I remember this happening was in the Warrior's path in the Crypt.

I'm pretty sure it happened in the fiery area of Cet's Pyramid which is why it was in my mind when I ranted--I mean composed my carefully thought out post.

I haven't tried tree surfing, yet.

"1a) 1000 click back out: Because of having to make jumps that, should I fail, necessitate me walking a long way back, I'm going to save before the jump just in case. So why, if I messed up do I have to: quit, quit, affirm I want to quit without saving, and if I actually want to quit the game I have to click at least 3 more buttons.
I appreciate a game that asks me if I really want to quit, but I tend to save first (because I never remember if the game really will, no matter how many times I've played it). But, yeah, it does take almost forever to leave..."

Yeah, I was thinking about whether it would have been possible to make it easier without sacrificing the safety of not accidentally saving over a precious game, for example. (Sidenote: In Wizardry 8, this was a problem, as I once accidentally saved over a party near the end of the game with a brand new party--this was due to a bug in one part of the game, however--and also managed to save over an Ironman, only 1 save slot allowed, party with a newbie party--that one was my fault.) The only time the WiznWar save/quit features really bug me is in areas like the bridge puzzle in Skull Isle where missing a jump (which I do well--klutz) results in either having to walk a long way back, or reloading.

"1b) Ridiculous stereotyping: Yeah, my Oomphaz is too fat to fit through that gap. I get it. It was funny the first zero times. My Ratling and Pixie are too short to hit the flying person. Haha.
I thought I only ran into that (too fat) in the underwaterpassage in the Serpent Temple (where I found it more than a wee bit annoying). Have you found it elsewhere? In the pyramid, perhaps? I do appreciate a game that realizes that a dagger from the back row just won't cut it, though..."

Yeah, I have had a lot of situations where the Oomphaz (and sometimes a Human or Dwarf) got into an area and couldn't get out, but switching to another character worked. My Oomphaz had a lot of spell-casting duties and was also the IDer, so whenever possible I would have him loot a chest the Ratling had recently opened. Then I couldn't move. I think the problem mainly came from moving into an area with a smaller character, then switching to a larger one.

And you're right, it is impressive when your staff-wielder whacks somebody and then the dagger guy misses because you're too far back. It takes a while to get into the groove of how close is close enough, but I do appreciate that. I was just miffed because my Ratling Ninja was too short to hit Kerah, his spells didn't affect her, and I had arrogantly sold all this throwing weapons. "Bah, who needs these toys."

Something I have wondered about but not been sure; is there any correlation between order of characters added to the team and order in the walking party? Out of reflex I put fighters in the first 3 slots and mages in the last 3, but it doesn't seem to matter, and people seem to get attacked from behind with the same frequency. But I haven't really studied it. BTW, if I forget to at the bottom of the post, remind me to tell you about Tiger the Damage Magnet.

"2) Collasium: Even if I hadn't had a tough-guy Dwarf going through it with no breathing equipment, it would have aggravated me. And how was I suppose to know I had to have 2 gems to get the final shard? And why couldn't it be spelled right?
LOL! I'm still not sure how to spell it!"

I guess I was thinking it was supposed to be like the Roman Colosseum (although there are different ways to spell this, ancient and modern), and in fact I was expecting to get into a gladiatorial fight there. Then again, it almost looks like "Collapsium," and it did kind of "collapse" into the ocean. OK, I concede this one, I was just being crabby.

"4) Game over classes: I guess this is supposed to make me want to play the game more, but ZM and Valk aren't even available until basically the last part of the last dungeon? Fun!
Yep, they show up too late for anything good (although the Den of Thieves appreciated the magic at the tail end). I would have liked them earlier, between Ishad N'ha and Brimloch Roon."

Yeah, I mean when I got done I wanted to start whole new parties, not, for example, start over with these guys. Oh, well. I kind of wonder if the Valkyrie was one of those things that got cut short by the game being rushed to completion. I didn't get to use mine much, but she didn't seem all that "Super-Elite."

"5) Sword of Xeen: The passing the sword technique was lame years ago. Hooray for revisiting it.
I never bother passing the sword. Everyone attacks, and I know that the four without the black-fired weapons are going to miss every single time. It takes too long to kill him otherwise... and in any case... [Smile]"

The 4 without the black-fired weapons. Is this in a party of 6. If so, tell me more, because I appear to be a dunce.

I don't think I could have beat him without passing the sword. As it was 2 of my characters who were passing the sword got killed and the third managed to kill Cet after a few more swings.

"6) Crashes: I have seldom played a game that crashed so much for no apparent reason.
Patched or unpatched? Video compatibility has played hob with this game, and we've usually been successful in getting people to run it without problems. *sniff* I used to say we never met someone we couldn't help, but the last couple of brave souls have been far trickier..."

I got patched early on, after doing the crazy dance a couple times. I wasn't really interested in exploiting the bugs, anyway, so it seemed like the best thing to do. I have occasional crashes, and the thing that gets me is that they don't seem to have anything particularly in common. I'll just be walking (or running, or swimming along, and the game goes "boink" and freezes up. I have to Ctrl+Alt+Del to get out. Hmm, maybe I should try reading those error messages, but it's hard because I can only see about half of them, the rest is hidden behind the Windows Manager window. Well, next time I'll try to have the patience to read the message instead of just ending the program and restarting."

I do like the 3D aspect of the game pretty well, and pretty much every night I have at least one dream which is a 3D adventure game. I am also having a lot of fun in my new games. I've noticed that a lot of games (and mods for games) I've played recently have been more enjoyable for me in the beginning and middle than in the end. Maybe it's just that the point of the journey is not to arrive.

Thanks for listening, and thanks for responding. It's also nice to know that I am not the only one who's had some of these concerns.

06-08-2004, 05:58 PM	#5
Dang The Magister Join Date: January 2, 2004 Location: Austin Age: 55 Posts: 125	Well, just so you know, I have already started 2 new parties, so I'm obviously hooked. Responding to Bungleau "1) Mario Bros: If I have to video-game jump to complete certain objectives, can I please not get stuck on objects for no good reason? Which leads to: Which area was this? Getting the fire ward in the last spot in the shrine? Or someplace else? Or are you referring to tree-surfing?" I can't remember any specific instances, but in several different areas I have managed to get stuck, sometimes on a wall, and not been able to get off. A lot of times the problem will be that my selected character is the Oomphaz, and if I switch to a Ratling or Pixie I can move again. Sometimes jumping fixes it. But there have been certain cases where I can't seem to get loose no matter what. The first time I remember this happening was in the Warrior's path in the Crypt. I'm pretty sure it happened in the fiery area of Cet's Pyramid which is why it was in my mind when I ranted--I mean composed my carefully thought out post. I haven't tried tree surfing, yet. "1a) 1000 click back out: Because of having to make jumps that, should I fail, necessitate me walking a long way back, I'm going to save before the jump just in case. So why, if I messed up do I have to: quit, quit, affirm I want to quit without saving, and if I actually want to quit the game I have to click at least 3 more buttons. I appreciate a game that asks me if I really want to quit, but I tend to save first (because I never remember if the game really will, no matter how many times I've played it). But, yeah, it does take almost forever to leave..." Yeah, I was thinking about whether it would have been possible to make it easier without sacrificing the safety of not accidentally saving over a precious game, for example. (Sidenote: In Wizardry 8, this was a problem, as I once accidentally saved over a party near the end of the game with a brand new party--this was due to a bug in one part of the game, however--and also managed to save over an Ironman, only 1 save slot allowed, party with a newbie party--that one was my fault.) The only time the WiznWar save/quit features really bug me is in areas like the bridge puzzle in Skull Isle where missing a jump (which I do well--klutz) results in either having to walk a long way back, or reloading. "1b) Ridiculous stereotyping: Yeah, my Oomphaz is too fat to fit through that gap. I get it. It was funny the first zero times. My Ratling and Pixie are too short to hit the flying person. Haha. I thought I only ran into that (too fat) in the underwaterpassage in the Serpent Temple (where I found it more than a wee bit annoying). Have you found it elsewhere? In the pyramid, perhaps? I do appreciate a game that realizes that a dagger from the back row just won't cut it, though..." Yeah, I have had a lot of situations where the Oomphaz (and sometimes a Human or Dwarf) got into an area and couldn't get out, but switching to another character worked. My Oomphaz had a lot of spell-casting duties and was also the IDer, so whenever possible I would have him loot a chest the Ratling had recently opened. Then I couldn't move. I think the problem mainly came from moving into an area with a smaller character, then switching to a larger one. And you're right, it is impressive when your staff-wielder whacks somebody and then the dagger guy misses because you're too far back. It takes a while to get into the groove of how close is close enough, but I do appreciate that. I was just miffed because my Ratling Ninja was too short to hit Kerah, his spells didn't affect her, and I had arrogantly sold all this throwing weapons. "Bah, who needs these toys." Something I have wondered about but not been sure; is there any correlation between order of characters added to the team and order in the walking party? Out of reflex I put fighters in the first 3 slots and mages in the last 3, but it doesn't seem to matter, and people seem to get attacked from behind with the same frequency. But I haven't really studied it. BTW, if I forget to at the bottom of the post, remind me to tell you about Tiger the Damage Magnet. "2) Collasium: Even if I hadn't had a tough-guy Dwarf going through it with no breathing equipment, it would have aggravated me. And how was I suppose to know I had to have 2 gems to get the final shard? And why couldn't it be spelled right? LOL! I'm still not sure how to spell it!" I guess I was thinking it was supposed to be like the Roman Colosseum (although there are different ways to spell this, ancient and modern), and in fact I was expecting to get into a gladiatorial fight there. Then again, it almost looks like "Collapsium," and it did kind of "collapse" into the ocean. OK, I concede this one, I was just being crabby. "4) Game over classes: I guess this is supposed to make me want to play the game more, but ZM and Valk aren't even available until basically the last part of the last dungeon? Fun! Yep, they show up too late for anything good (although the Den of Thieves appreciated the magic at the tail end). I would have liked them earlier, between Ishad N'ha and Brimloch Roon." Yeah, I mean when I got done I wanted to start whole new parties, not, for example, start over with these guys. Oh, well. I kind of wonder if the Valkyrie was one of those things that got cut short by the game being rushed to completion. I didn't get to use mine much, but she didn't seem all that "Super-Elite." "5) Sword of Xeen: The passing the sword technique was lame years ago. Hooray for revisiting it. I never bother passing the sword. Everyone attacks, and I know that the four without the black-fired weapons are going to miss every single time. It takes too long to kill him otherwise... and in any case... [Smile]" The 4 without the black-fired weapons. Is this in a party of 6. If so, tell me more, because I appear to be a dunce. I don't think I could have beat him without passing the sword. As it was 2 of my characters who were passing the sword got killed and the third managed to kill Cet after a few more swings. "6) Crashes: I have seldom played a game that crashed so much for no apparent reason. Patched or unpatched? Video compatibility has played hob with this game, and we've usually been successful in getting people to run it without problems. sniff I used to say we never met someone we couldn't help, but the last couple of brave souls have been far trickier..." I got patched early on, after doing the crazy dance a couple times. I wasn't really interested in exploiting the bugs, anyway, so it seemed like the best thing to do. I have occasional crashes, and the thing that gets me is that they don't seem to have anything particularly in common. I'll just be walking (or running, or swimming along, and the game goes "boink" and freezes up. I have to Ctrl+Alt+Del to get out. Hmm, maybe I should try reading those error messages, but it's hard because I can only see about half of them, the rest is hidden behind the Windows Manager window. Well, next time I'll try to have the patience to read the message instead of just ending the program and restarting." I do like the 3D aspect of the game pretty well, and pretty much every night I have at least one dream which is a 3D adventure game. I am also having a lot of fun in my new games. I've noticed that a lot of games (and mods for games) I've played recently have been more enjoyable for me in the beginning and middle than in the end. Maybe it's just that the point of the journey is not to arrive. Thanks for listening, and thanks for responding. It's also nice to know that I am not the only one who's had some of these concerns.