The Soldier
by Author Unknown

It is the soldier, not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press.
It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech.
It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who has given us the freedom to demonstrate.
It is the soldier, not the lawyer, who has given us the right to a fair trial.
It is the soldier, who salutes the flag, who serves under the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag.
A protest raged on a courthouse lawn, Round a makeshift stage they charged on, Fifteen hundred or more they say, Had come to burn a Flag that day.
A boy held up the folded Flag, Cursed it, and called it a dirty rag. An OLD MAN pushed through the angry crowd, With a rusty shotgun shouldered proud.
His uniform jacket was old and tight, He had polished each button, shiny and bright. He crossed that stage with a soldier's grace, Until he and the boy stood face to face.
FREEDOM OF SPEECH; the OLD MAN said, Is worth dying for, good men are dead, So you can stand on this courthouse lawn, And talk us down from dusk to dawn, But before any Flag gets burned today, This OLD MAN IS GOING TO HAVE HIS SAY!!
My father died on a foreign shore, In a war they said would end all war.
But Tommy and I wasn't even full grown, Before we fought in a war of our own.
And Tommy died on Iwo Jima's beach, In the shadow of a hill he couldn't quite reach where five good men raised this Flag so high, That the WHOLE DAMN WORLD COULD SEE IT FLY.
I got this bum leg that I still drag, Fighting for this same old Flag.
Now there's but one shot in this old gun, So now it's time to decide which one, Which one of you will follow our lead, To stand and die for what you believe? For as sure as there is a rising sun, You'll burn in Hell 'fore this Flag burns, son.
Now this riot never came to pass. The crowd got quiet and that can of gas, Got set aside as they walked away To talk about what they had heard this day. And the boy who had called it a dirty rag, Handed the OLD SOLDIER the folded Flag.
So the battle of the Flag this day was won By a tired OLD SOLDIER with a rusty gun, Who for one last time, had to show to some, THIS FLAG MAY FADE, YET THESE COLORS DON'T RUN!

author unknown

It is the soldier(or the armed forces) who takes life and perpetuates violence in a never-ending cycle.
And I don’t really think soldiers have given us freedom of speech. Politicians and peaceful methods, not war and force accomplish most of that sort of thing. This poem is really just a patriotic work.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Dramnek_Ulk:
It is the soldier(or the armed forces) who takes life and perpetuates violence in a never-ending cycle.
And I don’t really think soldiers have given us freedom of speech. Politicians and peaceful methods, not war and force accomplish most of that sort of thing. This poem is really just a patriotic work.<hr></blockquote>

Politicians send the soldiers out to die for a cause. How do you think the U.S. got its start? "excuse me Mr Britian would you be so kind as to leave our shores and let us rule ourselves?" LOL

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Dramnek_Ulk:
It is the soldier(or the armed forces) who takes life and perpetuates violence in a never-ending cycle.
And I don’t really think soldiers have given us freedom of speech. Politicians and peaceful methods, not war and force accomplish most of that sort of thing. This poem is really just a patriotic work.<hr></blockquote>

In the days when the military leaders ruled the nations and controlled them with an iron fist, those kind of ideas held more merit, but not today.

You can look at it that way, but it isn't really the whole truth is it? You have to know it's not that simple, nothing in life is that simple.

Not a single politician or person using peaceful methods is able to defend a nation against attack. Soldiers may not have introduced freedom of speach, etc., but they are the ones who defend and, in fact, guarantee those things with their lives. We just sit back and take them for granted, thinking we're entitled.

The latter part of the post you refer to is a just a patriotic work, but these statements are all quite true...

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Morgan_Corbesant:
The Soldier
by Author Unknown

It is the soldier, not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press.
It is the soldier, not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech.
It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who has given us the freedom to demonstrate.
It is the soldier, not the lawyer, who has given us the right to a fair trial.
It is the soldier, who salutes the flag, who serves under the flag, and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who allows the protester to burn the flag.<hr></blockquote>

If you don't believe it, take some politicians, some peace protesters, a copy of the Constitution and a UN Charter to Baghdad and see how far they get you. ;)

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>
Originally posted by :

It is the soldier(or the armed forces) who takes life and perpetuates violence in a never-ending cycle.

And I don't really think soldiers have given us freedom of speech. Politicians and peaceful methods, not war and force accomplish most of that sort of thing. This poem is really just a patriotic work.
<hr></blockquote>


Magness lets out a major sigh of frustration .....

Magness restrains himself from punching out his poor, innocent monitor...

Magness counts to 10, very slowly ... to ... calm ... dowm ...

AAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGGGGH!!!!!!!!!

Magness feels only slightly better.


Hey all you liberal i#%@#^%'s... peaceful means only work when those whom you protest against actually have some morals (and I don't necessarily mean religous morals) and are willing to listen and be swayed. Peaceful means do NOT work when the opponent is intent on conquest and your destruction!!!

I'd have loved to see a bunch of French protesters walking down the Champs Elysee (sp?) in Nazi-occupied Paris. I'm sure that Hilter would have just come to senses and leave France. Yeah... right. He'd have ordered them friggin' shot!!!

And like Khan said, I'm sure that the British would have just loaded up their ships and left colonial America prior to the American Revolution is we had just politely asked. Give me a friggin' break!!!


<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>
Originally posted by Ronn_Bman:

Not a single politician or person using peaceful methods is able to defend a nation against attack. Soldiers may not have introduced freedom of speach, etc., but they are the ones who defend and, in fact, guarantee those things with their lives.
<hr></blockquote>

Absolutely correct.


Morgan_Corbesant, great poem, whoever wrote it.

thanx, i cried when i read this. it is awesome. well, not cried like bawling my eyes out, but i was teary eyed. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Amen Morgan. Nuff said!

Well I'm afraid to say that you are all quite wrong :D .
Maybe once war could not be avoided due to primitive social structure (like in the middle ages) but for example the 2nd world war could have easily been avoided by less moral cowardice among the leaders of Europe. But in our modern age of nuclear weapons it is not longer necessary to go to war, just putting a bit more effort into the good ol' diplomacy and thinking of others opinions should do the trick, and other things like economic sanctions and loan withdrawal should work. Anyway if we look at human history it has been marked by progressive liberalising, I daresay that the British would have left America eventually and if Hitler had one ww2 I expect we would have ended up with the same sort of society we have today, as economic forces leading to social and political change drive history ever forward.
Violence always provokes more violence, and that leads to endless violence though human history, always has, always will. You cannot stop violence with violence.

<blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Dramnek_Ulk:
Well I'm afraid to say that you are all quite wrong :D .
Maybe once war could not be avoided due to primitive social structure (like in the middle ages) but for example the 2nd world war could have easily been avoided by less moral cowardice among the leaders of Europe. But in our modern age of nuclear weapons it is not longer necessary to go to war, just putting a bit more effort into the good ol' diplomacy and thinking of others opinions should do the trick, and other things like economic sanctions and loan withdrawal should work.

Anyway if we look at human history it has been marked by progressive liberalising, I daresay that the British would have left America eventually and if Hitler had one ww2 I expect we would have ended up with the same sort of society we have today, as economic forces leading to social and political change drive history ever forward.
Violence always provokes more violence, and that leads to endless violence though human history, always has, always will. You cannot stop violence with violence.<hr></blockquote>

Your first point has been proven completely untrue by history because sanctions do not always (read as never) work.

World War II "easily avoided"? Not if you look at the reality. I won't even accept that it could have been avoided with great difficulty.

You certainly make alot of grandiose assumptions about history that you cannot possible prove and that, quite frankly, defy logic because the ideas have no basis in any kind of fact. ;) You've made your decisions about how history could have been different after reading books saying "this and that", but you didn't live the experience. Neither did I, but I respect the experiences and decisions of those who did.

I don't completely doubt that Marxist ideas could work. I honestly don't, but comparing that theory, as if its a true alternative, to reality just doesn't work on any level. You don't do your ideas any justice. Hate capitalism because you hate capitalism, and love Marxism because you love Marxism, but don't try to use one to justify the other.

In theory, Santa Claus has a much better mode of transportation than any of the advanced nations of the world... ;)

yeah, im sure bin hiden would say, oh, im sorry, i was in the wrong. lets talk about this diplomaticaly. he allready said he was out to DESTROY America. to me, that means he isnt willing to talk. and if we just talk it out, then those 5000 lives were lost for no reason. i say turn their whole worthless bass ackward country to glass. just my two cents though.