http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4012839.stm

Choice extract (but read the whole thing - I've only quoted the few bits that I wanted to highlight. There's something for all sides in his article however)

[ 11-15-2004, 10:37 AM: Message edited by: shamrock_uk ]

So this guy thunks its going to be a long time before the Middle East stops fight'n & fued'n, Well spank my rear end and paint it purple. The nearly 5,000 years of recorded Human History in the Middle east didn't give it away that they have been and will continue to fight & fued? There ain't but one way to stop them folks Kill them all every man, woman, child, all their goats, sheep, cats and dogs. Utterly destroy every living thing, anything short of that will only alow the fight'n & fued'n to continue. It ain't pretty and it ain't fair it IS.

just sarcasm right?

<font color = lightgreen>Mostly sarcasm, yes, but also quite true.</font>

<font color = lightgreen>I agree. Don't let's look at our report card on combatting terrorism over the last 30 years--we would definitely have an F. Even modern conveniences such as the Patriot Act and the Dept. of Homeland Security have done next to nothing to actually make this country any safer; one need only scan news articles for a one-month period to see how many security breaches occur at airports for proof of this.
Don't blame only Bush, though; blame all of Washington, D.C. Remember that Clinton missed a couple of chances to catch or stop bin Laden but did not. Bush the Elder took Noriega into custody but let Hussein go free. Reagan struck at Quaddafi, but never laid a finger on Arafat. Finally, Carter suffered a humiliating defeat at the hands of Khomeni.

We are making--have continued to make--two key mistakes in dealing with the Middle East.
One: our continuing close ties with Israel. I challenge any average American to name one resource or service we receive from Israel; I, myself, cannot name one--because we don't! The reason we continue to have such a close alliance with Israel is because of the Holocaust. We felt such pity for what they suffered--as we should have because it was horrific--but this mentality continues today. Anyone who speaks out against Israel is labelled "anti-Semitic" (despite the fact that Jews are not Semites, but that is another story altogether....) or potentially Hitlerian. Bottom line, this alliance means we enter any discussion with any Middle Eastern country with a low reputation, and reputation is still the key deciding factor for personal discussions in that part of the world.
Two: our delusion that Saudi Arabia is our friend. Washington, get a clue: they tolerate us because they have to, not because they want to! Hello! Does it escape our attention that Saudi Arabia continues to be one of the worst human rights violators in the world? The Royal Family may do what they please, when they please, how they please, to whomever they please, and no one can speak out against them; at least, not if they don't want to spend the rest of their life in prison. It's a kingdom; you know, that thing against which both America and the French revolted.

I'm still working on the last topic, the one about "worrying over public opinion". I know how to deal with--and possibly stop--terrorism, but I haven't finalized my ideas. I am still trying to find the logical end to that line of thinking, contrasting my ideas with our strategy in Vietnam, and trying to see what the end results would be. At the very least, I'm not ready to state those ideas publicly; they might be...over the top.</font>

just sarcasm right? </font>[/QUOTE]What Azred said [img]smile.gif[/img] Over the top truth, for the entire recorded human history they have fought amoungst themselves, oh they may have a generation that decides let's stop, but the next one that comes along starts it up all over. So for anybody to propose that the last 30 years of the USA doing something or not doing something it is assinine at best plain hot-monkeysex, sweat dripping reproduction stupid at worst, unless they can show me how 30 years in the 20th & 21st centurys can effect the 4970 years preceding. These people have blood fueds that have been going on for 1,000's of years, think about that really think about that. Then ask youselves how could the last 30 years be anything other then an excuse, and there is a difference between an excuse and a reason.

Hey Azred they are what we would now call Iraqi's. ;)