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This topic was inspired by the discussion I had with babar on another thred. So the question is what character do you think is worst:
1) in solo? 2) in a party of normal characters (meaning characters who are of a class their race is at least moderate in) You can also throw in explanations if you want to. [ 01-14-2004, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: dplax ] |
1) I'd say any char since I'm still getting my bum sorely owned solo ;) But I guess any non-hybrid non-dualed class would suck.. I'm a poor judge of that tho.
2) Hard to say, I'm under the impression that any class is very powerful at higher levels, but I'm not at all impressed by Psionics and Gadgeteers... then again, I only played them up to 10-11 somewhere |
As can be deduced from my other posts, I'm still playing my first Wizardry 8 party -- but already I can tell that Gadgeteers do *not* suck.
Spoiler ahead! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I have taken my party as far as Bayjin, and my Gadgeteer has already got a gadget that casts Asphyxation -> UNLIMITED MASS KILL! (Just remember to cast some Stamina on the Gadgeteer every now and then.) Oh yeah, he's also got various other useful gadgets (Heal All, Prismic Ray, Boiling Blood, Instant Death/single target, X-Ray, Superman, Hypnotic Lure, Armourplate, etc. etc.), all UNLIMITED as long as you keep the Gadgeteer in good stamina. And I believe that there are a few extremely powerful gadgets that I have yet to find. Then there's the Omnigun. The most pathetic missile weapon at first, but it gradually gets better. It will eventually accept practically ANY ammo (including the special arrows & bolts) and, as a bonus, inflict status ailments on the victims (or even critically hit them). My Gadgeteer blinded Nessie with his Omnigun, and regularly knocks out enemies. Never mind the Tripleshot Crossbow & Eagle Eye that my Ranger has -- the Gadgeteer is FAR more deadly from a distance. The Ranger may get two missile criticals per round, so what? The Gadgeteer will have insta-killed 50% of the enemies in the first round anyway! The Bishop & the mage cannot cast their mass kill spells (Death Wish & Asphyxation, respectively) even half as effectively as the Gadgeteer operates his Negatair. Besides, they will exhaust the spellpoints in a few attempts anyway (the mage at least; the bishop has got hundreds of Divine spellpoints, though, but they are also needed for other spells). The only downside is that unless I limit the Gadgeteer's use of gadgets somehow, my other characters will never get a chance to improve their skills in combat. The Gadgeteer will have killed everything in two rounds or so. [img]smile.gif[/img] Add to that, the Gadgeteer advances levels very quickly; he's the highest-level character in my party (the mage has missed some experience due to getting killed a couple of times, otherwise it would be a draw with her). If I had to pick a character class that seems definitely weaker than the others, from my experience it would be the priest. I simply cannot see any reason to pick a priest instead of a bishop (except for deliberately making the game more challenging). Well, yes, I did replace the priest I originally had with bishop as soon as I figured this out. The Lord is so-so, a good (but not excellent) fighter and a good (but not excellent) spellcaster. But at least I can turn him into a fighter when I don't want any more spell advancement for him, then he'll play like a fighter with some spell talent. I obviously haven't soloed yet, so I cannot answer the first question. [ 01-15-2004, 03:30 AM: Message edited by: seclists ] |
1: I haven't played a solo up to now so I don't know.
2: In all of my games there were characters I used very rare (Samurai or Ninja ) But worst ? If I have to select one : I think Psionics fit that the most. They have no special abilities with the exception of mental immunity and because I had always a bishop in my usual parties and also a Priest/Lord combination there was no need for me to create one. But then again : I think, there is no exact definition of worst because every character that fits in a party isn't worst. No player uses characters he don't like, but IMO that has nothing to do with the meaning of "worst". F.e. In some posts players mentioned Fairie Bards are bad characters but in my current party I have one and I must say, she makes her job well ( in the way I want it in my game, of course ). (Dplax: I hope, I understand your question correctly) [img]graemlins/monster5.gif[/img] |
Never gone solo passed the monastery, but in a 6-8 character party, gadgeteers have consistently been the weakest class for me. I usually ascend around lvl 23-25, so the omnigun is never finished, the insta-kills are too few and the damage output too minimal. I can imagine in a party of 3-4, they might do OK, but snce gadgies are severely underpowered for the first half of the game, I seriously doubt it. The only thing I like about them is their gadget attacks are not reflected. IMO
EDIT - Worst character ever-> LOL... Solo Faerie Gadgeteer!!! But that's so crazy, it just might work...LOL [img]smile.gif[/img] [ 01-15-2004, 09:08 AM: Message edited by: Kylospylon ] |
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(from the originating post)
I think at game start, fairy samurai are as bad or worse than fairy fighters, but in the end, the fairy samurai is much better. Not being able to take advantage of the sword skill bonus is bad, but worse is the lack of a decent weapon. You'll have hold on to the fairy stick for a while, but after the game progresses, there are some decent staves you can use, and I would guess that lightning strike (tiger strike?) + critical strike + weapon special effect would be as good or better than fighter KO% + stilleto 10% kill. Too bad samurais, can't use ninjata or stilletoes, otherwise, it'd be no contest. The only drawback I can think of is that starting mid-late game, you probably need to find a stamina regen device or else all the lightning strikes may start to add up. But, by that time, the samurai should have the relevant skills (CC, CS, Weapon) reasonably developed and also have at least a few spells that can make combats shorter (enchanted blade and missle shield in your front pocket and a couple of fireballs in your back). Not sure how much fairy mana regen will be worth, but at least the samurai can take advantage of it. From the point of worst character being defined as least able to take advantage of racial and professional abilities and equipment, I'll still have to go with fairy bard. Kylospylon mentioned fairy gadgeteer, and the weight/carry capacity problem with them might even be worse, but I think they are slightly better because they can be effective with just the Omnigun. Without external training, the lack of advancement in bard's music skill can be crippling, in as much that you might be better off with different profession. The bard only skills, improve party camping and communication, don't seem especially useful, unless used to mitigate the effects of being a fairy in the first place ... less camp time to regenerate stamina (if you choose to do that, and not even sure it would make a difference, since it recovers fast enough just standing around), but might not need it if STR PIE VIT weren't so low; better prices at shops, but (esp. for solos) what are you going to buy?, because you can't use anything, except maybe stamina potions). |
I think that gadgets are much lighter than instruments, so the faerie bard would be worse than the gadgeteer.
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Let's ask the oracle, the ten heaviest of the gadgets&instruments are:
Strobe Light 9.0 Prismic Ray Chromatic Lyre 10.0 Itching Skin Horn of Fear 12.0 Terror Forcefield Generator 15.0 Armorplate Hades Harp 18.0 Cerebral Hemorrhage Silent Lyre 18.0 Silence Succubus Song 18.0 Lifesteal Water Cannon 18.0 Tsunami Jackhammer 20.0 Earthquake NegatAir 24.0 Asphyxiation That's 5 instruments and 5 Gadgets. But 1 and 2 go to gadgets, 3 is a tie, _and_ of these spells i'd easily dump itching skin, terror, armorplate and silence, leaving 4 gadgets and 2 instruments. I'd say Gadgets are _way_ heavier than instruments (but than they are better as well ;) ). |
I wouldn't dump the armorplate gadget, which is great if you don't have a spellcaster to do it. And it is also good to train engineering skill with. BTW thanks for the info on the weight of instruments /gadgets.
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