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-   -   Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy (http://www.ironworksforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=102073)

Ladyzekke 07-28-2011 07:42 PM
Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
This is the latest and greatest trial going on here in the U.S. To me he is more of a cult leader, but many would say it is a true religious practice.

I believe that in the U.S. everyone is free to have their own beliefs and religious practices....as long as you have free will choice. In this case, it seems many women, many children really at 13 years of age, living in a closed community with no choice but to marry some old man who could be their grandfather, or in at least one instance, their cousin. Apparently younger men were kicked out so the old ones didn't have any competition. I am sure for many of the young girls there was no escape out of the community as they were watched like hawks. Many were physically abused as well (twisting their braids was not only allowed if one disobeyed, but encouraged).

W. Jeffs now wants to represent himself in court, so it will be interesting to see how it all turns out. I myself find it really dispicable, but that is based on my own personal beliefs. Again I believe in freedom to choose, and if a woman is happy in that situation, than fine then. I do know there are places where polygamy is allowed, but I just don't like the idea of the forced part, and the child/abuse part. Ick.

Anyway, below is a link to the entire story (it really begins on page 4). What do you guys think? OK cause it is their religion and they should be free to practice whatever they want? Or sounds like a twisted cult? What do you think W. Jeffs should be convicted of, if anything?

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/c...s/1_index.html

Azred 07-28-2011 10:41 PM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Anyone who supports homosexual marriage must also support polygamy for the same reasons--if the adults in question freely wish to enter into a marriage contract, even with multiple people, then they should be allowed the freedom to do so.

Now...Warren Jeffs is a Texas native and he makes the rest of us look bad. He is a cult leader no matter how you look at the situation and the practices of forcing teenage girls into marriage is simply disgusting.

His ploy of representing himself is simply a tactic at delaying the trial. If I were the judge, I would make him sign a document stating that he cannot in the future claim "improper representation" and then let the trial proceed as normal. If he wants to act like a fool then let him be sentenced like a fool.

Timber Loftis 08-01-2011 12:17 AM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azred (Post 1246573)
Anyone who supports homosexual marriage must also support polygamy for the same reasons--if the adults in question freely wish to enter into a marriage contract, even with multiple people, then they should be allowed the freedom to do so.
A ridiculous proposition. I had to counter this when I was interning with the VT state legislature, and they wondered whether or not enacting a civil union law would beget polygamy in the state. It doesn't work that way -- the union the state can choose to allow or disallow is a two-person union, and it doesn't extend to groups, else we would have droves of people clamoring to get wholesale marriage benefits for all group members, just so everyone could benefit economically. Plus, there is a whole line of SCOTUS cases regarding polygamy that you would need to overcome, including the ones that drove the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints to lose almost all of their lands and then regain some of them. I would add more, but that is not the point at issue. Start a separate thread if you like. Feel free to include the argument that if gay marriage is allowed then you can also marry your dog/cat -- it's as easily defeated.

Beyond that, regarding any arrangement, I will say that CONSENT is paramount. We don't seem to have that in this case. Note: under the age of 16 (most states), you are unable to consent to anything legally.

Azred 08-01-2011 11:23 AM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
hrm...I see what you are saying here--there are cases in Japan and China of people marrying pillows (not a regular pillow, mind you, but a full-length body pillow with an anime character on them and...erm...ports for ease of access--gross) and pets.

No, there is no way that consent can be valid in this case since the girls are clearly minors.

The latest I heard on the radio was that Jeffs declared that God would punish everyone involved with the trial. I presume that he meant himself as well, yes?

Ladyzekke 08-01-2011 06:47 PM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Yes I read he made quite a spectacle of himself, making long ranting sermons, and when asked questions taking a full minute or more to answer, etc.

I also read that he is one of 60 children from his father, and he himself has 100 children!

I hope he gets decent jail time. For someone who abused women and young girls for so long, I like the idea of him being locked up with nothing but men around.

John D Harris 08-01-2011 08:58 PM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azred (Post 1246573)
....His ploy of representing himself is simply a tactic at delaying the trial. If I were the judge, I would make him sign a document stating that he cannot in the future claim "improper representation" and then let the trial proceed as normal. If he wants to act like a fool then let him be sentenced like a fool.
No need to state the obvious.... Hale's bell's it's hard enough to give one you're full attention and still make you're tee time.... and this fool wants a bunch.

Timber Loftis 08-02-2011 02:30 AM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by John D Harris (Post 1246675)
No need to state the obvious.... Hale's bell's it's hard enough to give one you're full attention and still make you're tee time.... and this fool wants a bunch.
Hey, JD, quick note that I think you have two contractive "you're's" in there when I think you want the simple possessive "your" in both instances.

John D Harris 08-02-2011 03:59 PM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timber Loftis (Post 1246683)
Hey, JD, quick note that I think you have two contractive "you're's" in there when I think you want the simple possessive "your" in both instances.
Naaa, they did their job, got you so worried about my spelling you're running around like your heads on fire and you ass is catchin :P

Bungleau 08-05-2011 02:40 PM
Re: Warren Jeffs trial - Forced Polygamy
 
Quote:
SAN ANGELO, Texas (AP) — A jury convicted polygamist sect leader Warren Jeffs of child sexual assault, in a case stemming from two young followers he took as brides in what his church calls "spiritual marriages."
If only the trolls in Kansas would get caught doing something as loony...


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