on saturday i stood with many other people who couldn't in all honesty cope with the idea of attacking a country and the consequent destruction of life and escalation of killing/revenge that would stem from such an action. as a pasifict i feel strongly that those associated nations whose governments are intent on becoming involved in this conflict should stand up and make public their disapproval and total lack of support for the coming military actions. has anyone else joined forces with like minded people to stand in a public place to exhibit their dissent?

i don't think there is anything else that objectors can do except to stand up and be counted. any suggestions? i think our governments are heading for disaster and there's nothing i can do about it, except to demonstrate peacefully and hope that numbers will count for something.

I am total agreement with you, I wish there were a peaceful solution to all the problems in the world right now. I think the US is acting too harshly and I don't think they've given themselves the time to think about the situation properly. I only hope this 'war' doesn't escalate and lead up to World War Three or anything like that. I also hope innocent people are spared any violence and that Bin Laden (or whoever is responsible) is dealt with in a subtle, effective, permanent fashion so we can all just get on with our lives.

------------------
http://freeservices.homestead.com/files/sig.jpg

Hear hear!! What I don't understand is how come the US, given that they spend so much on intelligence, have not infiltrated bin Laden's core group? Ok, not the easiest task in the world, but then nor are the alternatives.

------------------
http://www.asnsoup.com/silvercheetahfinal.jpg

Silver! I believe the reason is that years ago it was decided that our government did not want to get involved with people who are criminals, civil rights abusers, and just downright direputable types. These are the only people who would be able to infiltrate the terrorist groups. I hope this answers your question. I may not have this entirely \right, but I'm sure someone here will readily correct me.

Mark

In actuality we do spend a lot on intelligence, but recently (last 10 years) the spending has been drastically reduced. The problem then is what do you spend the money on...electronic or human intelligence. We have gone the way of electronic intelligence and even the top people (director of intelligence...) are saying that was the wrong way to go.

I think it would be extremely hard to infiltrate bin Laden's group. It is sure death if one is caught, unlike other 'spies' that may just face jail or imprisonment while the countries work out a deal for release.

Now in response to the 'peace' notion. We are dealing with terrorists that have proven time and again that they are willing to kill without regard to civilians/military/men/women/or children. While a peaceful solution, of course, is ideal, in this context it is out of the question. Terrorists kill and destroy...there are no ifs ands or buts about that. They will not negotiate, they will not attend 'talks' or 'summits'...they kill! The only way to deal with them is to attack and destroy them. If we sit back and try to solve this in a civalized manner then we are all but dead. I for one do not want my government to try and reason with these people, b/c it cannot be done. Do you want to get on an airplane, or attend a huge gathering, or take a job in a large office complex, while your government sits back and tries to negotiate with barbarians? I don't!! Barbarians only understand death and destruction and that is what needs to be dealt to them...not a nice letter pleasantly asking that they don't kill any more people and turn themselves in http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...s/rolleyes.gif


------------------
http://www.bestanimations.com/fantas.../dragon-04.gif

Never try to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and it annoys the pig
I've got to admit it's getting better, it's getting better all the time
Bossman of Better Funny Stuff.....of the Laughing Hyenas!

Sky, I know for a fact that can't be right. The present government, not to mention those preceeding, seem to have some kind of a revolving door policy when it comes to big companies such as Exxon, Monsanto and so forth. So no real problems with criminals and disreputable types, then....... http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/frown.gif At least, not when it comes to giving them jobs or being given jobs by them, giving them money, being given money by them..... and so on.

I think you'll find the policy has something to do with the air in the Middle East. Not healthy, or something.........


------------------
http://www.asnsoup.com/silvercheetahfinal.jpg

Moridin, while I understand your viewpoint, and to some extent share it, you must realise that any MILITARY action will cause the deaths of very many innocent people - far more than were killed in the airplane attacks.
Even if it is PROVED that bin Laden was behind it - and it hasn't been yet - the Afghani people as a whole cannot be held responsible for him and his terrorists. YET IS THESE PEOPLE who will suffer in any military action. You can be sure bin Laden and his followers are in a place of safety. The ONLY sensible thing to do is to try and make the Taliban see reason and hand him and his people over to justice - INDEPENDANT justice: NOT US justice. NOT UK justice. NOT European justice. He should be tried by combined Western/Eastern juctice, including Russian and China. That way we stand a chance of coming out of this with no more damage.

------------------
http://www.ranchoweb.com/images/bg2guy/bitchingcopy.gif

http://www.ranchoweb.com/images/bg2guy/fljotsdale.gif

This was reported on some news show that the CIA was not supposed to deal with these types of people. I think this happened 6-8 years ago! Anyone else see this? Either that or I've been dreaming! http://www.ironworksforum.com/ubb/no...iles/smile.gif

Mark

Moridin.

I find the way you are treating the people who think killing more people is deplorable, insulting.

Mark

we can have a world anit-terroists action by TALK/NEGOTIATE with Muslim nations